del

Yes that is my understanding of it. It is not homoeopathy, but is the use of one or two of our medicines given for any complaint or given just as a tonic/general health remedy.

Often Joe gives both Arnica and Nat-phos together.

Have you really reached such a desperate point in treatment?

Well that is a shame. I never like seeing people driven away from homoeopathy into the various pseudohomoeopathic approaches.

I can understand I suppose feeling disappointed so far in the homoeopaths who have not been able to solve your case. Being familiar with it, the prescriptions of Nat-mur Staph etc have all been shallow. You would be better off with a homoeopath who uses a more advanced method like Sensation in my opinion.

Where do you live?

To Girl

It was interesting to note that David Kempson has responded to your post which you entitled 'Joepathy' of which I am now considered internationally as the author, after many years of being castigated by the classical sect, which includes David, for promoting the use of Arnica on a daily basis as it can only do the user a lot of good which David describes as being 'given just as a tonic/general health remedy. '

He is correct in his statement that I give Nat Phos 6x and Arnica 30c in the Wet dose together. I do not however do so in every case as the Nat Phos is included only if the patient complains of some gastric imbalance which is soon corrected by the NP after which it is discontinued. The Arnica however is continued for as long as is necessary if the patient feel that it is doing some good. In my case I have taken it for the last 16 years nightly or more often depending on need.

Incidentally you do not have to 'really reached such a desperate point in treatment?'. The idea in taking Arnica is to PREVENT your ever reaching that desperate point.

David entitles my Joepathy as 'the various pseudohomoeopathic approaches. ' He is advised to visit the website of the Doctors Prasanta and Pratip Banerji on the link below to verify and hopefully follow in their footsteps which are also my own in the direct 'This for That' approach to Healing which both the Banerjis and I have promoted independently for the last 25 years in their case and 10 in mine.

http://www.pbhrfindia.org/

David insists that any ailment can only be treated with Classical Homeopathy but I differed from the strict Hahnemannian Diktat many years ago when I discovered that it was just not helping the patients as effectively as my own Joepathy did. This did create many problems especially on the Homeopathic forums that I visit and I can see that David has finally accepted that he cannot quell me into submission to his classical therapy as an unbiassed assessment of the cases that I have treated when compared to his will indeed prove that I lead by a clear margin.

If you are interested in doing some reading on my Joepathy you can Google this word and also visit my website : www.joedelivera.com

It would be of interest to learn from you the reason why you are taking Arnica which I hope has been made in the 30c potency in the Wet dose, which I presume you know how to make.

Also stay away from David's 'Sensation' therapy which is the latest he has cooked up.

Glad to learn that the one and only dose you gave your Mom helped her:
'and immediately when she took it she felt really good mentally and said everything looked sunnier.'

The reason why she did not improve is because you have her just ONE dose. You are expected to give her at least 2 doses daily for the next few months. It is essential that the bottle is shaken (succussed) hard before each dose to make it more effective than the last.

Forget your other homeopath who will most likely shudder at my therapy aka 'Joepathy'.

Report her progress weekly.

The fact is that it has been proved to work with your Mom and it will help her as long as you follow my instructions.

You may like to know that at age 82 I have taken Arnica 30c in the Wet dose nightly or more often on demand for the last 16 years and can recommend it to anyone to be taken as prescribed by me.

I am not aware of how old you are yourself but if you are around 40 years you too can benefit from just one dose taken just before bed.

I have said this to you many times - you cannot just give a random example like that and expect someone to be able to interpret it. Every reaction needs to be seen in context of the whole case, with attention paid to Direction of Cure.

Well Joe you really are out of touch with the real world of homoeopathy aren't you?

Sensation homoeopathy is currently practiced by some of the most famous homoeopaths in the world. I din't 'cook it up' but it has been formulated by Dr. Rajan Sankaran and his colleagues in India.

Joepathy is not homoeopathy at all, not even slightly. If people want to use psuedohomoeopathy that is their choice, but it will never replace real homoeopathy. But we have had this argument before and it goes nowhere.

I would avoid using Arnica this way if I were you. Many patients suffer suppression and side effects from its use, as they do from using Nat-phos inappropriately. You can find their posts all through this forum. Arnic used this way is actually Allopathy, and mostly produces palliation at best, or suppression at worst.

To David

Joepathy is NOT Homeopathy it is an advance on the strict classical concept of Homeopathy which I too used to practice many years ago but when I discovered that it was just a waste of time in trying to cure the many ailments that patients presented both in Sri Lanka and on the forums that I visit even today, I changed over to Joepathy, which as you are aware is not a term that I coined but it was coined by another of your ilk, another classical homeopath who used to frequent this ABC forum Gavini Murthy who was responsible for a great deal of unnecessary consternation which he later recanted and stated:

'You must have observed that I am not the die hard classical homeopath any more.
I now appreciate that homeopathic medicines are capable of curing even when used in the non classical way. '

I am gratified that I am not the only purveyor of Joepathy and the Drs Prashanta and Pratip Banerji have boldly expressed their own views about classical homeopathy which they have replaced with the equivalent to my own Joepathy where they stated openly in many open Homeopathic Forums throughout the world that they are both using the 'This for That' technique which they have found after 25 years of using the classical method, as this direct method works.

You are advised to visit their website on the link below to realize that they are both highly qualified in Homeopathy, which I am not, and treat over 1500 patients on a daily basis in their Homeopathic Foundation in Kolkata.

I do hope that you will spend some useful time in listening to their lectures on this website and after doing so, you can then let me have your comments on whether or not my Joepathy is valid to CURE many ailments as it has done over the past 10 years of my directly using it in spite of the attacks that I have had from Gavini Murthy and now you yourself on this ABC.

David, you may be qualified in Homeopathy but can you match my record of cures ?

Joe De Livera





I am copying the text of the link below which is relevant to my contention that Joepathy is more effective than classical homeopathy in the rate of cure.

http://www.abchomeopathy.com/forum2.php/231958/

Re: bandarbabu2000 From gavinimurthy [Log on to view profile] on 2010-06-29
Simon's action is only symbolic in nature to suggest to ignore the posts from those who can't see eye to eye with you.

All you have to do is to logout to read the whole thread uninteruptedly.

It is a slight inconvenience but is a constant reminder to see if we can improve our ways of communication with one another.

As Joe says the majority of homeopaths are 'this for that' prescribers. Though that is not the perfect way the patients feel it is better than plain allopathy.

Over a period of time I too feel that majority of patients who are not sensitive can benefit to some extant with these 'this for that' prescriptions.

Though their ability to cure is doubtful the patient gets some relief and he is thankful for that.

I too observed that for non sensitive patients either the medicine works (sometimes partially) or it doesn't work. It is rarely that it spoils the case further provided the repetetion is not excessive.

The danger is much less with split/ wet doses.

People's perception change over time. Who knows one day I too may join the bandwagon and become 'this for that' prescriber. :-)

If and when I choose to do that I am afraid the space for other prescribers will be limited. (Just joking)

All is well that ends well.

I may still differ with you but the tone of my opposition will never be hostile hereafter.

If we all decide to discuss on points and avoid personalities we can all live together harmoniously on this forum.

I am extending my hand with a positive spirit. I hope all others will reciprocate and make this forum a joy to visit.

Murthy

Re: bandarbabu2000 From Joe De Livera [Log on to view profile] on 2010-06-29
BRAVO GAVINI !!!

I look forward to meeting you on Skype shortly when we can discuss some outstanding matters.

In the meanwhile I am copying a statement that I addressed to Manish Bhatia of Hpathy.com where I expressed my views on the reason why I felt that Homeopathy was slowly DYING at least in the Western countries. I copied my statement on the ABC shortly after I rejoined it last December.

I am convinced that if all of us who are dedicated to healing with Homeopathy join forces and use my direct 'This for That' form of therapy aka 'Joepathy' we can avoid the infighting among the ranks that I feel is the cause of this 'Dying' Syndrome and what is more important, the patient who presents the ailment will be cured in the shortest possible time as per Hahnemann's First and Second Aphorisms.

' 1 The physician’s high and only mission is to restore the sick to health, to cure, as it is termed.

2 The highest ideal of cure is rapid, gentle and permanent restoration of the health, or removal and annihilation of the disease in its whole extent, in the shortest, most reliable, and most harmless way, on easily comprehensible principles.'

http://abchomeopathy.com/forum2.php/128112/

Re: Homeopathy in UK From Joe De Livera on 2009-12-29

I am copying below my reply entitled 'Response to a Sad Editor' addressed to Dr Manish Bhatia on his Hpathy Forum website on:

http://www.hpathy.com/ezine/feedback/2008aug-ed.asp

I felt that my reply to his request to respond would be a useful addition to this Thread which will be bumped up for the enlightenment of members.

My response is about midway down the list of replies which Homeopaths throughout the world sent Manish which are all worth reading even though it may take some time to do so.


August 2008

Dear Manish,

I have just received the July edition of 'Homeopathy 4 Everyone' and would like to place on record my admiration of your attitude to Homeopathy today which is so different from the autocratic classical attitude you displayed in your Hpathy Forum a few short years ago when you banned me from it merely because I prescribed Arnica for an ailment I cannot recollect.

I presume that you are aware that I am not a qualified Homeopath as this science is only a Hobby to me and I treat all patients with the remedy, free of charge. I am thankful to God that it has remained that way as the therapy that I give those who consult me is not governed by the strict classical rules which I sometimes use with Radar when the remedy for the ailment eludes me. It is just that feeling of satisfaction that I get in helping anyone who consults me that is the reward that I get that keeps me active in Homeopathy, sometimes to defend my non classical attitude to Homeopathy as I have always found that my direct approach works admirably well in comparison to the classical attitude of the 'single remedy to treat all the symptoms', which usually does not.

You may perhaps be aware that a few classical members on your forum resented my direct 'this for that' approach to Homeopathy and often used to criticize it, sometimes in a disparaging manner. They later labelled my attitude to healing as 'Joepathy' and this term was later picked up by the Search Engines which today lists about 150 hits under this title. It is possible that the reason for this interest may be due to the fact that the various remedies that I have used which are recorded in the homeopathic forums that I used to visit in the past and the Homeopathy and More Forum that Praveen Wadhwa and I share and visit daily today, have sufficient evidence to prove that the non classical approach to Homeopathy aka Joepathy, works admirably well. Since my conversion to the Wet Dose by Dr Luc de Schepper with whom I was closely associated during his short visit to Sri Lanka in 2003, I have been more successful in helping patients who seek assistance from the 4 corners of the world and I am happy that many have confirmed that they have been cured of chronic ailments like Asthma, Eczema and Arthritis to name just 3 that I have used my default remedies to cure or at least stabilize, thereby enabling the patient to stop dependence on the drugs that they had been using for many years.

I have often wondered what the reason was for the interference that I encountered on the forums that I used to visit in the past and it occurred to me that at least some may have been prompted by the fact that I have invariably indicated that I am not a classically trained homeopath but that I had a background of study of the science and my own experience dating back from 1968 when I was first introduced to Homeopathy as my guide in prescribing for the many ailments that I encountered. It is possible that the responses which grateful patients sometimes recorded on the threads may have irritated the classical types as they did not seem to equate the same rate of success that I had achieved and this lead to their harsh criticism of my therapy merely because it was non classical.

I am copying a paragraph taken from your Editorial below:

'The editor in me is sad, not just because I have seen the differences in our community from very close quarters, but also because I see little 'dialogue' or effort to find some uniformity in our methods of practice. While people are now willing to share information through Hpathy, I still see a lot of reservation in engaging in a one-to-one or an open dialogue about specific practices. Homeopathy today is like the conventional medicine of Hahnemann's time. Anyone can come up with any interpretation of our history, any new idea, hypothesis or theory, any method of practice and there is no critical scrutiny by the community. And if you are a big shot, nobody even thinks about questioning your new 'discoveries'. People either follow those ideas or they do not. Everybody is happy in his/her own cocoon. We are a very passive community. There is no central authority to check the validity of numerous claims made by different people. There is no central effort to resolve the timeless questions that haunt homeopathy.'

I am indeed grateful to you for having stated what to me is obvious but which when read from Hahnemann's classical standpoint can be interpreted as heresy. I am in complete agreement with you in your view and it does seem a shame that the big names in the science have their own views on even basic matters and prefer to pontificate on them merely because they are 'great' however far they are from the truth . I can think of George Vithoulkas condemning in his lectures on Arnica that it must never be used as a pain reliever and never before and after surgery. I have proved otherwise. There are numerous examples of these same greats pontificating about remedies but obviously not taking the time to test their pet theories in actual practice.

In the final analysis it is not the method used, classical or non classical that matters in the treatment of disease. It is the remedy that will achieve the fastest cure without causing the patient any discomfort and restores him back to health as per Hahnemann's first Aphorism.

I shall follow your progress in your open attitude to Homeopathy and hope that you will succeed in opening the eyes of the classical fraternity that it is time that they shed aside their classical blinkers and use remedies in the manner that many of us have pioneered and recorded instead of criticizing us for having deviated from the strict classical method of treatment which does not achieve the same results that the direct Joepathy 'this for that' method does.

Kind Regards

Joe

Re: bandarbabu2000 From girilal [Log on to view profile] on 2010-06-29
Or may be Arnica worked on Gavini.

Re: bandarbabu2000 From PANKAJ VARMA [Log on to view profile] on 2010-06-29
I can't place my finger on it...but...still I am not convinced.

I think I have seen too much of the other side of Gavini to believe that he has changed !!

I still don't forget the days when he used to post donkey's pictures here at ABC to be-little ABC.

I still cannot forget the personal humiliation he and Scott splashed on me during those days.

To say: 'All is well that ends well' ...sounds simple
...he can say it ...coz he was not at the receiving end.

I need an apology from him to bury the past.

Pankaj Varma

To David

My apologies for not posting the link to the website of the Drs Banerji (Father and Son) who see over 1500 patients on a daily basis in their Hospital where they treat all patients Free of Charge (like me).

Their full title is:

Prasanta Banerji Homeopathic Research Foundation

Kolkata

The link to their website is:

http://www.pbhrfindia.org/

As far as I am aware they do NOT use 'Sensations' which your erstwhile friends specialze in perhaps to pull the wool over the eyes of their patients.