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ACUTE, ill after vaccination
Wednesday two weeks ago (the 7th) my horse got a (booster) tetanus shot. He was fine that evening but the next day he had a high fever (39,8 C) and was breathing fast, very lethargic and depressed. Also very stiff.First I gave Thuja but that didn't help at all. So I gave Aconitum and that brought the fever down a bit, though he still had a fever for a couple of days. He has also got acupuncture treatments. Then he seemed to recover and I started riding him lightly. He was bright but still stiff.
Then a couple of days ago he seemed even more stiff and the area where he got the vaccine started to swell. I gave him arnica and also put arnica liniment on it. It didn't help and it's just got worse! Today I find him with a fever of 39,7 again and his neck is now so stiff, swollen and sore that he hasn't even been able to lie down during the night.
I've given him Aconitum again and treated SP2 and LI4. He also got 1 g of fenylbutazone which is the treatment my vet advises (though in larger dose).
I've also got him on herbs, echinacea and rosehips.
He is a gelding, half thoroughbred, very big (177 cm), chestnut (red), 13,5 years, sensitive but strongwilled. He has never previously had a reaction like this to a vaccine.
I don't understand it, why is he just getting worse? When the first fever disapperared I thought he was genuinely better. He didn't have the swelling at first, it's appeared later. It's the muscle in the neck, right in front of the shoulder. The swelling is hard, hot and sore.
What would you do to get him well?
Thanks in advance,
Maria
mirald on 2011-12-21
This is just a forum. Assume posts are not from medical professionals.
♡ maheeru last decade
I would actually suggest Rhus-tox for this, and at least a 200c potency. You need to go higher for an emergency situation like this.
The other option for treatment would be to use the remedy we make out of the Tetanus vaccine, in an isopathic manner to try and cancel out the damage.
Btw, you can see why homoeopaths are so opposed to immunization. I have seen so much damage, so much harm done by them. It is a terrible practice.
The other option for treatment would be to use the remedy we make out of the Tetanus vaccine, in an isopathic manner to try and cancel out the damage.
Btw, you can see why homoeopaths are so opposed to immunization. I have seen so much damage, so much harm done by them. It is a terrible practice.
♡ brisbanehomoeopath last decade
Thanks for your replies! I've considered Rhus Tox actually, and also Silicea. But isn't Silicea more of a chronic remedy?
I totally agree with you about the dangers of vaccination, and the only thing I do vaccinate against is tetanus since horses have such a high risk of contracting it. I thought that was a reasonably safe vaccine, but obviously I was wrong!
I totally agree with you about the dangers of vaccination, and the only thing I do vaccinate against is tetanus since horses have such a high risk of contracting it. I thought that was a reasonably safe vaccine, but obviously I was wrong!
mirald last decade
Every remedy can be acute or chronic - that label is applied to the patient not to the remedy.
Half of the tetanus cases in Australia occur from the vaccine. It is far from safe, and in fact no vaccine at all is safe.
Half of the tetanus cases in Australia occur from the vaccine. It is far from safe, and in fact no vaccine at all is safe.
♡ brisbanehomoeopath last decade
Thank you.
I've always considered Silicea more of a chronic remedy, probably because it says in my MMs that it's slow and deep acting. But as you say, that does not say that it's not for acute illnesses.
A quick update. Horse has been on antibiotics and an NSAID (analgesic and antipyretic) for 5 days. Yes I know that's not good but I felt I had to do something and that's what the vet prescribed (actually he prescribed 5-10 days)...
He got no antibiotic today but 0,5 g of the NSAID, that's one sixth of the prescribed dosage of 3 g a day (I've only given him 2 g the other days).
The swelling has not gone down at all. If it actually were caused by a bacterial infection it should have gone down, right? It feels like it's in the muscle, it's not in the skin. He has not had a fever while on the NSAID but of course I know that's only masking the symptoms. The antibiotic has also given him diaorrhea despite additionals probiotics.
As of tonight I aim to stop the allopathic drugs as they're not doing him any good (suprise). I have given Silicea D30. I think I have D200 too, is that better suited for this case?
I emailed a veterinary homeopath who recommended I make a D6 of the vaccine. Sadly I doubt my vet will give me one! Nosodes are not allowed for sale where I live, but I've ordered a Tetanus nosode from Germany. Don't know when it will get here though, with all the red days.
Should I keep giving Silicea and hope it will eventually turn him around? It's a lot harder to wait and see with an animal, I worry about not doing the best thing for him and causing him suffering.
He fits the mental picture of Silicea, sensitive yet stubborn.
It also says in my MM that a dose of Sulphur might clear the path for the Sil to work better. Would that be wise, since we've 'clouded' things with drugs?
I've always considered Silicea more of a chronic remedy, probably because it says in my MMs that it's slow and deep acting. But as you say, that does not say that it's not for acute illnesses.
A quick update. Horse has been on antibiotics and an NSAID (analgesic and antipyretic) for 5 days. Yes I know that's not good but I felt I had to do something and that's what the vet prescribed (actually he prescribed 5-10 days)...
He got no antibiotic today but 0,5 g of the NSAID, that's one sixth of the prescribed dosage of 3 g a day (I've only given him 2 g the other days).
The swelling has not gone down at all. If it actually were caused by a bacterial infection it should have gone down, right? It feels like it's in the muscle, it's not in the skin. He has not had a fever while on the NSAID but of course I know that's only masking the symptoms. The antibiotic has also given him diaorrhea despite additionals probiotics.
As of tonight I aim to stop the allopathic drugs as they're not doing him any good (suprise). I have given Silicea D30. I think I have D200 too, is that better suited for this case?
I emailed a veterinary homeopath who recommended I make a D6 of the vaccine. Sadly I doubt my vet will give me one! Nosodes are not allowed for sale where I live, but I've ordered a Tetanus nosode from Germany. Don't know when it will get here though, with all the red days.
Should I keep giving Silicea and hope it will eventually turn him around? It's a lot harder to wait and see with an animal, I worry about not doing the best thing for him and causing him suffering.
He fits the mental picture of Silicea, sensitive yet stubborn.
It also says in my MM that a dose of Sulphur might clear the path for the Sil to work better. Would that be wise, since we've 'clouded' things with drugs?
mirald last decade
Maria
Do you not have silicea 30c or 200c? D30 and D200 are not sufficient. Between D30 and D200, D200 is better.
One need not wait long to see if a remedy is making a beneficial effect, in case of an animal, if the remedy is not doing good in 2 to 3 days, then another suitable remedy may be administered.
Homeopathic Tetanus nosode is a great idea, having it in 30c or 200c will help better.
What remedies have you got and in what strengths(potency)?
[message edited by maheeru on Sun, 25 Dec 2011 19:59:50 GMT]
Do you not have silicea 30c or 200c? D30 and D200 are not sufficient. Between D30 and D200, D200 is better.
One need not wait long to see if a remedy is making a beneficial effect, in case of an animal, if the remedy is not doing good in 2 to 3 days, then another suitable remedy may be administered.
Homeopathic Tetanus nosode is a great idea, having it in 30c or 200c will help better.
What remedies have you got and in what strengths(potency)?
[message edited by maheeru on Sun, 25 Dec 2011 19:59:50 GMT]
♡ maheeru last decade
'Everyone' uses D potencies here, C is hardly ever used. M occasionally for people.
So no C potencies I'm afraid. Not sure if DCG, the manufacturer here in Sweden, even makes them. I can check with them when they open.
I have most of the usual remedies you will need for animals. Most in D30 and some in D200. If you have any suggestions I can check.
I'll email the German supplier and see if they can supply 30c and 200c instead.
[message edited by mirald on Sun, 25 Dec 2011 21:05:24 GMT]
So no C potencies I'm afraid. Not sure if DCG, the manufacturer here in Sweden, even makes them. I can check with them when they open.
I have most of the usual remedies you will need for animals. Most in D30 and some in D200. If you have any suggestions I can check.
I'll email the German supplier and see if they can supply 30c and 200c instead.
[message edited by mirald on Sun, 25 Dec 2011 21:05:24 GMT]
mirald last decade
I found a bottle of Silicea M. Is that better than D200?
mirald last decade
D30 and D200 may not be sufficient. 30c or 200c would be effective and more useful compared to D30 and D200.
I'm not sure the M you're talking about is M for 1000c or MM scale. If it's 1000c, then it's worth trying out a dose --it's more powerful than 30c or 200c....repetition must be less with this. So after giving a dose, observe changes and report in a couple of days.
Do you have sulphur in 30c or 200c or only in D30/D200?
I'm not sure the M you're talking about is M for 1000c or MM scale. If it's 1000c, then it's worth trying out a dose --it's more powerful than 30c or 200c....repetition must be less with this. So after giving a dose, observe changes and report in a couple of days.
Do you have sulphur in 30c or 200c or only in D30/D200?
♡ maheeru last decade
mirald last decade
If it's not 1000c but 1 MM then the best thing you have is 200D. Give this, three to four times a day.
What are you giving as of now? Do you see any change?
Can you get 30c or 200c for any remedy in a short notice(in 2 to 3 days)?
What are you giving as of now? Do you see any change?
Can you get 30c or 200c for any remedy in a short notice(in 2 to 3 days)?
♡ maheeru last decade
Probably not, but I can ask!
As of now I am giving him Silicea D200 morning and evening. He seems happier, but the swelling has become bigger and he can't bend his neck to reach the ground.
As of now I am giving him Silicea D200 morning and evening. He seems happier, but the swelling has become bigger and he can't bend his neck to reach the ground.
mirald last decade
For the next 2 days, increase the dosage to four times daily and see if there's improvement in the swelling, stiffness and the use of neck. If not stop silicea, and start on belladonna.
♡ maheeru last decade
He has had the nosode for a couple of days. Some improvements but now worse than before. Swelling is even bigger. I don't know what to do, I can't understand this.
mirald last decade
Just palpated it and my fingers leave marks, ie oedema. Am trying apis.
mirald last decade
Did you or did you not give belladonna? If yes what was the response?
In what potency are you giving the nosode?
Have you started apis or going to start? If you have not started on it, please put it on hold.
In what potency are you giving the nosode?
Have you started apis or going to start? If you have not started on it, please put it on hold.
♡ maheeru last decade
D30 nosode, frequent dosing in the beginning then twice a day.
I've ordered a 200c too but have not got it yet.
No, haven't given belladonna yet as I don't really think it fits his overall symptoms? There's no high fever or agitation, and the swelling does not look red from what I can see under his coat.
Actually I'm beginning to feeel certain it must be an abscess... Thus I have given Hepar Sulph D200.
But I'm very worried that we might have to open it surgically, with all the drugs that will entail. Not sure if I dare wait much longer, I'm worried about necrosis and muscle damage since it is so big.
I've ordered a 200c too but have not got it yet.
No, haven't given belladonna yet as I don't really think it fits his overall symptoms? There's no high fever or agitation, and the swelling does not look red from what I can see under his coat.
Actually I'm beginning to feeel certain it must be an abscess... Thus I have given Hepar Sulph D200.
But I'm very worried that we might have to open it surgically, with all the drugs that will entail. Not sure if I dare wait much longer, I'm worried about necrosis and muscle damage since it is so big.
mirald last decade
Belladonna is not a remedy for fever and agitation alone.
And the unavailability of C scale esp. 30c and 200c is very difficult as results from D30/D200 may not give the desired output.
And the unavailability of C scale esp. 30c and 200c is very difficult as results from D30/D200 may not give the desired output.
♡ maheeru last decade
I have the nosode in 200c on order, what other remedies would you suggest I order and in which potency? I can get them, just takes a while.
It is news to me that D potencies are not so good. I've seen a lot of homeopaths through the years and also I have studied equine homeopathy and acupuncture. Still I have never been prescribed or recommended anything but D potencies, occasionally 1M.
It seems there is some regional contradiction about what to use.
You're right, my potencies are NOT giving me the output I desire. I feel there is a pattern of slight improvement for 1-3 days, then he relapses and is the same or even worse than before.
I thought I was choosing the wrong remedies but you think it might be a question of giving the wrong potency?
I've been googling and it seems that injection site abscesses are not that uncommon, I suspect that is what he has. I just tried to investigare the colour of his skin. It is blue/black in a 1 cm2 spot, which is where he got the injection. Small areas around it are red. The rest of the swelling/abscess has normal colour. There is no leaking of fluid, it's dry and hard.
Also, he sweats around his head, neck and shoulders pretty much every night around 8-10 pm.
I at first thought I had too many rugs on him, but he can wear the same rugs the whole day, in the same temperature, but he only sweats at night.
Another thing that may be of help is that he is very hungry! Even more than what he normally is I would say.
[message edited by mirald on Tue, 03 Jan 2012 21:46:50 GMT]
It is news to me that D potencies are not so good. I've seen a lot of homeopaths through the years and also I have studied equine homeopathy and acupuncture. Still I have never been prescribed or recommended anything but D potencies, occasionally 1M.
It seems there is some regional contradiction about what to use.
You're right, my potencies are NOT giving me the output I desire. I feel there is a pattern of slight improvement for 1-3 days, then he relapses and is the same or even worse than before.
I thought I was choosing the wrong remedies but you think it might be a question of giving the wrong potency?
I've been googling and it seems that injection site abscesses are not that uncommon, I suspect that is what he has. I just tried to investigare the colour of his skin. It is blue/black in a 1 cm2 spot, which is where he got the injection. Small areas around it are red. The rest of the swelling/abscess has normal colour. There is no leaking of fluid, it's dry and hard.
Also, he sweats around his head, neck and shoulders pretty much every night around 8-10 pm.
I at first thought I had too many rugs on him, but he can wear the same rugs the whole day, in the same temperature, but he only sweats at night.
Another thing that may be of help is that he is very hungry! Even more than what he normally is I would say.
[message edited by mirald on Tue, 03 Jan 2012 21:46:50 GMT]
mirald last decade
If you had administered arnica 200c or even Ledum 200c, there was a significant chance that this could have been prevented.
Wrong remedies can impact the output, but most often close remedies can move a case ahead. So here, i think yes potency was the primary factor.
Regional contradiction can happen in the availability or widespread use of a particular scale or particular strengths of a remedy. But effectiveness and desired result do not always depend upon this factor. In my view, the case in hand is beyond the potential of D scale.
Our immediate requirement is sulphur in 200c. Other remedies to have in 200c are: ars. alb., rhus tox., merc., calc.carb., silicea, Lycopodium.
Wrong remedies can impact the output, but most often close remedies can move a case ahead. So here, i think yes potency was the primary factor.
Regional contradiction can happen in the availability or widespread use of a particular scale or particular strengths of a remedy. But effectiveness and desired result do not always depend upon this factor. In my view, the case in hand is beyond the potential of D scale.
Our immediate requirement is sulphur in 200c. Other remedies to have in 200c are: ars. alb., rhus tox., merc., calc.carb., silicea, Lycopodium.
♡ maheeru last decade
Managed to get hold of sulphur 200c! Hav not given yet, just got it. How to dose?
Also, yesterday I had the vet out for an ultrasound to see what it looked like inside, and if there was an abscess we could easily drain. Sadly this was a big stress for him as the vet gave him way too much sedation and he is worse today. Tired and sad and seems worried about what is happening in his neck.
But what we did discover is that there is not one large abscess. It looked like lots and lots of tiny abscesses, about the size of a large grape.
If I can't stop it from spreading and start healing with homeopathy he will have to be trailered 3 hours and have surgery. That will be so traumatic for him.
Here is what it looks like:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y220/xxwitchxx/5112d651.jpg....
[message edited by mirald on Thu, 05 Jan 2012 14:49:37 GMT]
Also, yesterday I had the vet out for an ultrasound to see what it looked like inside, and if there was an abscess we could easily drain. Sadly this was a big stress for him as the vet gave him way too much sedation and he is worse today. Tired and sad and seems worried about what is happening in his neck.
But what we did discover is that there is not one large abscess. It looked like lots and lots of tiny abscesses, about the size of a large grape.
If I can't stop it from spreading and start healing with homeopathy he will have to be trailered 3 hours and have surgery. That will be so traumatic for him.
Here is what it looks like:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y220/xxwitchxx/5112d651.jpg....
[message edited by mirald on Thu, 05 Jan 2012 14:49:37 GMT]
mirald last decade
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vW-zKmD_8Tc
As shown in the video dosing can be done dry, aqueous either from bottle and syringe or from bucket.
Choose one mode and use 3 to 5 pills or drops for a dose, and dose two times daily for 3 days.
As shown in the video dosing can be done dry, aqueous either from bottle and syringe or from bucket.
Choose one mode and use 3 to 5 pills or drops for a dose, and dose two times daily for 3 days.
♡ maheeru last decade
Thanks.
I gave him a dose at 5.30 pm. An hour later his temperature had risen and was 38.7. But now, at 10 pm, it's down to 38.44 again so naybe an initial response to the sulphur?
I gave him a dose at 5.30 pm. An hour later his temperature had risen and was 38.7. But now, at 10 pm, it's down to 38.44 again so naybe an initial response to the sulphur?
mirald last decade
It's not uncommon to have slightly elevated temperature after sulphur as it increases the circulation.
How's he doing?
How's he doing?
♡ maheeru last decade
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