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Vaginal Tear latest Post Page 4 of 6
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Hi I am new to this forum and also have some vaginal tearing. I find it very disappointing to see that most women do not heal from this...I have been doing some research and came upon these articles... I have not tried this nor do I recommend it just thought some people might find this interesting. Sorry for the length but it wouldnt let me paste the website.
Super Glue for Repairing Tears
First do a thorough exam to determine the extent of the tear. Then we are off to informed consent. The decision about who, what, when, where, why and how the tear will be repaired Must be meticulous. Then, clean the wound, dry the tissues after placing a piece of gauze into the vagina just deep enough to absorb the lochial flow and keep the perineal area dry. Air drying is ok but a hair dryer is great. Approximate the edges of the tear and apply the glue to either side of the tear and then after pulling the sides together, put on one or two more strips to meld it all together. The strips are thin, not globby! The perineum should be monitored very closely, glue reapplied if there is separation. The glue falls off as a plaque some days later,. It is even more important for the mom to be clean, off her feet, no stairs or car rides, and no tailor sitting. The edges of the tear will not heal properly if the edges are pulled apart. The best healing takes place with any alternative, with mom in bed cuddling and nursing that new baby!
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Just ran across a synopsis of an article from Pediatrics 1996:98:12-14. Some peds emergency depts did a study comparing suturing to Histoacryl Blue (a type of superglue) in repairing pediatric lacerations. There were 30 kids in each group. Time involved in repair was 7 minutes with superglue as opposed to 17 minutes for suturing. Pain during repair was significantly less with superglue and the parents were quite impressed! And, photos the the wounds before and after closure (at 1 wk and 2 months follow-up visits) were assessed by 2 plastic surgeons who were blinded to method of repair. They declared similar or better healing outcomes with superglue. Additionally, because superglue peels off spontaneously in 5-8 days, there is no need for suture removal.
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First of all, the tear needs to be fresh, clean, and fairly shallow with straight edges that lie together on their own. The glue is applied to bridge over the closed edges, not inside on raw surfaces. (Covering the raw surfaces with SuperGlue could actually PREVENT the surfaces from knitting together!) Insert a tampon first and insert your finger between the edges and pull it out to bring the edges forward slightly. This ensures that edges won't roll inward toward each other, but meet perfectly. You could also use a tissue forceps for this. Hold gauze below apex to catch any drips and apply tiny dots of glue sparingly where the edges meet. You can also apply a bead of tiny droplets to bridge the edges. Use a hair dryer or fan to dry, which takes about 30 seconds. The adhesive stiffens as it dries and prolonged soaking isn't too good for it. It will flake off by itself in usually less than a week. Some rare allergic reactions are inflammation and swelling. I learned everything I know about this from one of my favorite teachers, Anne Frye.
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I've just seen the 10 day pp results of my first attempt with supergluing a laceration. She did not want sutures, but wanted to do something about it, so the husband went out and got some OTC superglue. Worked great. Too great. Superglued my glove to her pubic hair, then a gauze pad to her thigh. It does dry as immediately as it does when using it for other things. I was amazed at how it held in spite of the "wetness of the area." The "crusty" of the glued area fell off spontaneously at four days. It looks the same as if it had been sutured, except I do think it healed much faster. The mom is THRILLED, but she talks to a couple of other women who I assisted, one got sutured, one didn't and wishes she had....they want to know why I didn't superglue them!! ;)
I'm sold on the idea enough to try it again when it seems appropriate. My current definition of appropriate is when I look at the laceration and say, "Ooooh, if I only had some tape that would stick...."
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What is your reasoning for using the tissue paper? Is this so you can't overdrip on the tissues?
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Yes, it's all a control issue. I like to hold tissue edges together in a nice apposition and I had too much trouble with gluing my gloves to the repair. Then the repairs would pull apart as I struggled to get free. When I soak a tissue, though, and then glue my glove to the tissue instead, I can pull my glove away, the tissue tears, and I'm free without disturbing the repair.
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Would it work to superglue the perineum after suturing the vaginal vault?? I ask this because it seems less painful. Considering the vault has no nerve endings, I would assume that you could repair without anesthetic or undue pain for the client. Possible or not ???
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I've never used super glue. Do you think that a first degree would heal just as well without it? I'm afraid that I might make the situation worse if I got glue in a place that kept the would edges from healing together. Could you elaborate?
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I do use super glue for 1st degree tears, the gaping kind you look at and say, "Geez, if I could only tape it together for a week." It works wonderfully!!!! I have been considering making it part of the birth supplies list that parents have to acquire...it won't go to waste. They can always use it around the house, and it only costs $2. I do carry the medical super glue, but it is significantly more expensive, and there are times when I run out, and I like to know it's on hand with the parents.
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I get medical super glue from a vet supply house (Jeffers). I think I remember that it has somewhat of a different chem composition...I can't remember exactly what it is, but it's documented somewhere. Honestly, I'm questioning if it's as effective, but generally, it's ok, and I strive to use it more frequently. It is tinted light purple which makes it easier to visualize. It comes with tiny pipettes, so that you can use the same bottle for multiple people. I have no problem, however, with using OTC super glue. There was an article written somewhere QUESTIONING (not proving) if super glue would burn tissues. That has not been my experience. The women do not feel it at all.
As I said, I use super glue for the types of tears which are 1st degree and gaping...the kind that obviously will probably not heal well on their own because the edges are too far apart...the kind you look at and know that if the outside would just sit together, she might heal fine with nothing. The glue does just that...holds the outside together so the insides can heal (tears heal from the inside out).
The idea is not to put the glue into the raw part of the tear. The idea is to create a BRIDGE of glue across the outside surface of the skin (think "taping it together"). I have spilled glue onto the raw parts of the skin, and we have had no detrimental effects, but I can imagine that it would deter healing if those surfaces are coated. I place a fairly think bond, so that she can feel it (but not so thick that it easily peels off). That is part of the healing process for me...if she can feel it tugging when she assumes certain positions, it reminds her to be cautious. For most women, it falls off about day 5-8, just enough time to do its job (if necessary, we redo it). The first few times I used it, the women soaked daily, and the bond stayed intact. Then I started having a few come off (I went and redid it). They all approximated well in the end except one, but it was a hassle to have to go back and redo it. Now, I am experimenting with having women shower only, no soaks, and I have had NONE of the glue come off (but the glue didn't come off in the first few I did who DID soak, so that doesn't say anything). I just tell them it may decrease the likelihood that it will come off, and since these are women who are motivated to heal without large intervention, they agree it's worth it.
As far as holding it in place, I don't really. The super glue works on bottoms as it does on anything else...FAST. I have glued gloves to pubic hair, and I have had a few anuses that got glued shut when the glue dripped down...no big deal...we just clean it off and laugh about it. The glue's a little tough to work with at first, until you understand how it drips. I once found a newer type, a GEL super glue, and I loved it, but I haven't been able to find it lately. It was thicker, so it didn't run off as quickly. You learn to like certain brands with certain applicator tips.
I've had one client on whom it just did not hold...she was Japanese, though I can't imagine that has anything to do with it. I was amazed as I'd already used it several times with great success with other women, and it just would not adhere to her skin. She adamantly refused suturing completely. She did not heal well.
As far as ethics...well, primarily, my ethics start with me and the families I serve. When someone is refusing suturing but is amenable to super glue, it's more ethical to use it than not suture for a tear that needs approximation. I don't see it as a huge risk really. I know there is always the possibility it could become an issue, but as homebirth midwives, we do lots of things that aren't documented in medical literature, and hell, DOCS do lots of things that are not documented in literature (or are clearly documented as poor practice, but they do it anyway). I try to practice carefully, but I don't know of any midwife who does everything by the book...sometimes, the book just ain't written yet and we are ahead of the game! We can't make all our choices based on whether it's been tried and proven, because that is the only way things DO get tried and proven. Anne Frye wrote an article on it a few years back which I am sure one of our more "file-it-away" type midwives here would have.
Some ERs are using it for facial wounds on children, finding less scarring and quicker healing and significantly decreased emotional trauma (at least one study was done). It's a pretty old idea.
Bottom line, the clients LOVE it, and it works. They are so thrilled with the results, and so am I. My birth asst had a baby last month, and she opted for super glue. It fell off at day 2 (she was up way too much), so we re-did it. It worked great, and she is so excited to have learned first-hand a midwifery trick that she can carry with her into her own practice when she becomes a midwife.
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I've now used super glue on two minor 1st degrees with excellent results.
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I recently heard one OB say that it cannot be used on mucous membranes...but au contraire.
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I have used Nexaband for two 2 nd degree tears. Had absolutely wonderful results. Both mothers refused any sutures.
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I've used this stuff a few times, and really like it. It's a snap to use. The way I purchased it, it came from a midwifery supplier (bought at a MANA conference), with syringes so that you could use the same bottle several times without contaminating it. Just fill the syringes with how much you need (a little goes a long way), then take off the needle (if you want) to squirt it on the area to be repaired. I only use it for first degrees (not quite sure I want to rely on it for a muscle repair), that are a little more than superficial. It has worked quite well, and the moms are very happy with it, since there are no stitches or xylocaine involved. The "superglue" eventually sloughs off once tissue starts healing back on its own.
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The company I use the most, Revival, has 3 brands of skin adhesive. Vetbond 3ml #15-251 $12.25, Nexaband liquid 2ml #95-210 $16.95 and Skin Bond 4 oz liquid #95-212 $12.45
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Medical superglue is great. The kind that has been approved for humans has a slightly different chemical composition than the veterinary superglue. I avoid the 3M brand (which I think is Vetbond), because it's exactly the same chemical comp as superglue. If I'm gonna just use superglue, then I'm going to pay superglue prices, not the more expensive vet product prices. Nexaband is a different comp except for one of their products which is the same as the Dermabond that is the human equivalent. Medical superglue has been used for years on humans, though I doubt they've ever done trials on perineal use. They're using it more and more on peds.
It is wonderful for first degree tears that need SOMEthing. I agree that it's not the thing to do for muscle tears, since those will shrink back and not often just heal without being held together. The glue is not placed inside the vault; it's used on the outside only. The ladies on whom I've used it have been so happy to avoid suturing. The glue sloughs off in about 6 days or so...they can even bathe with it. A few times, I've had the glue fall off too soon, so I've just reapplied it...usually, the women have admitted to picking at it or thinking it was dried blood and pulled it off accidentally.
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I know a midwife who cuts up a strip of gauze and uses medical-grade adhesive to glue it in place over the tear - kind of like an iron-on patch, but without the iron. It allows air and fluid to pass through nicely and stays in place for about four days.
ps --as to the question of WHY someone would glue rather than suture: some women absolutely refuses stitches, many midwives are legally prohibited from suturing, glued wounds don't sting as much a sutured wounds when moms urinate, and surgeons report that glued wounds heal very nicely and very quickly, probably faster than sutured wounds.
SuperGlue not for 2nd degree tears
2nd degree tears are, by definition, those which involve some muscle damage. Muscles tend to retract into the tissue on either side and are deep to the surface of the repair, making them totally unsuitable for repair with tissue adhesive. Tissue adhesives are designed to act like a butterfly bandage, one or more thin lines of glue are applied to bridge across the skin surface on either side of the tear (perpendicular to the line of the tear) it should never be placed down inside the tear or applied to both sides of the raw tissue and then pressed together, as you would do if gluing an object because it will form a film that impairs cell regeneration and prevents oxygen from getting to the tissues. Therefore, it is unsuitable for all but the most shallow tears. I agree, in most cases, if tissue adhesive is suitable, so is leaving it to heal on its own. Plus tissue adhesive is full of chemicals. It is glue. Does that really sound like such a swell thing to be putting near raw tissue? Suture is bad enough in this regard.
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Importance of Medical Grade vs. Over-The-Counter Super Glue
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From Anne Frye's Healing Passage, 5th edition, p. 44.:
Tissue adhesive: In 1959, a variety of cyanoacrylate adhesives were developed, some types of which are now used for wound closure in Canada and Europe. Some midwives have assumed that retail cyanoacrylate adhesives such as Super Glue are identical to medical adhesives. However, retail products contain methyl alcohol because it is much cheaper to produce, and are manufactured to industrial, not medical, standards. Cyanoacrylates cure by a chemical reaction called polymerization, which produces heat. Methyl ester has a pronounced heating action when it contacts tissue and may lead to tissue necrosis during metabolism.
Medical grade products contain either butyl, isobutyl or octyl esters. They are bacteriostatic and painless to apply, produce minimal thermal reaction when applied to dry skin and break down harmlessly in tissue. They are essentially inert once dry and have been shown not to be carcinogenic. Butyl products are rigid when dry, but provide a strong bond. Available octyl products are more flexible when dry, but produce a weaker bond. Ideally the wound to be closed is fresh, clean, fairly shallow, with straight edges that lie together on their own. The glue is applied to bridge over the closed edges; it should not be used within the wound, where it will impair epithelization. The only FDA approved adhesives suitable for use as suture alternatives are veterinary products; n-butyl-cyanoacrylate tissue adhesives Vetbond (3M) and Nexaband liquid and octyl-based Nexaband S/C (intended for topical skin closure when deep sutures have been placed). Histoacryl Blue (butyl based) (Davis & Geck) and Tissu-Glu (isobutyl based) (Medi-West Pharmaceuticals) are sold in Canada for human use. DMSO (dimethyl sulfoxide) or acetone serve as removers. (Helmstetter, 1995; Quinn & Kissick, 1994)
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Well, I disagree. Real-life experience (not theory) is that OTC superglue does NOT cause burns or tissue necrosis!! An awful lot of folks have posted here about using OTC superglues-- they haven't posted any experience of burns or necrosis, have they?
Anne's a friend of mine; but even the best of friends can disagree. We've both looked at the same information; we drew different conclusions
Also -- I'm very certain that Anne has never personally used either surgical adhesive OR superglue. I think this is a simple instance of over-emphasis on theory....
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I disagree about the relative importance of using medical grade surgical glue.
While I agree that medical grade super glue is probably (theoretically) superior to the OTC stuff, I do have to defer to the real-life experience of a LARGE number of non-insured Americans who have been using OTC superglue for many years.
I first heard of it years ago from a woman who described how she treated a boy for shallow buckshot wounds. It didn't matter that the boy was an innocent bystander on a school play-yard - the family had no money to pay an emergency room medical bill. So the wounds were washed out -- EXTREMELY WELL!!!! -- and tacked with superglue. I was impressed with the healing when I saw it after a week or so....
Even the outlaws and other "fringe classes" all know the basics of selfgluing -- they make certain the wound is clean and leave a space open for drainage....
OTC superglue is classic folk medicine!
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Used it for the first time at 2 of the most recent births I did. It is SO fantastic!! I sutured with chromic gut in the interior, then closed the exterior by dripping it criss-cross fashion over the exterior. No pain (as outer stitches always hurt/I don't use lidocaine) and it healed beautifully!! I am sold on it.
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Ordering Medical Grade SuperGlue
1-800-JEFFERS
Nexaband wound closure "SuperGlue" cyanoacrylate
item #FACU $7.65 for a 2 ml tube w/extender applicators
Livestock/equine shoulder-length OB gloves (for waterbirth)
item #ATG2 $9.90 for a box of 100
There's a $5 service charge for orders under $50. If you order for a group of midwives, you can order 2 boxes of gloves and 4 tubes of Nexaband for just over $50, to avoid the service charge.
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From: (Steven B. Harris)
Subject: Re: Dr. Weil
Date: 17 May 1997
>
>>> Dr. Weil is also amazing. This man has
>changed my life, and I can also guarantee the same promise from
>THOUSANDSIs this the same Dr. Weil who feels that cracked skin on the heels is due
>to the dry atmosphere (he suffers from it himself), and recommends that
>superglue be used to bind the edges together? He also recommended using
>superglue to bind the edges of cuts. Guess we have to sift the wheat
>from the chaff.
Superglue was used by trauma surgeons in Vietnam to glue the edges
of lacerated livers together (ever try to SEW liver?). Works great.
It also works perfectly fine in normal skin wounds, and is non-toxic.
The only reason it hasn't been approved by the FDA for this purpose is
that the studies would cost millions, and who's going to pay them?
Superglue has long since passed off-patent.
I work occasionally at a private research lab which does
experimental surgical research on animals. In dogs, we had a lot of
problem with oozing and infection at sites where arterial catheters
were left in. Now we superglue them and all that problem is gone. The
glue doesn't interfere with healing, and it seals excellently. It is
as resistent to abscessing as staples, and seals far better. For
wounds in animals which have been anticoagulated, it's a godsend.
Survival animals which have catheters pulled later suffer no ill
effects, and the wounds heal fine.
Weil has many areas where he's out to lunch, but superglue isn't one
of them.
Steve Harris, M.D.
Search for Google's copy of this article
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From: (Steven B. Harris)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Wounds requiring stitching and Coloskin
Date: 19 Dec 1998 07:00:52 GMT
>>Basically it's just "Super Glue" (cyano-something-or-other). If there
>>really is a difference between the hardware store version and the much
>>more expensive medical version, I don't know what it is.
>
>You'd probably have to ask on sci.chem exactly what the difference
>is, but this is the basis:
>
>Superglue as normally formulated is either too good or not good enough. A
>healing wound requires an elastic and permeable seal. Superglue from the
>hardware store is too stiff and makes a fairly impermeable seal. It has
>taken a very long time (20 years? longer?) to discover a modification to
>superglue which allows the wound to breathe without being too weak to
>hold well.
>
>The glue bond also has to degrade in the skin as new tissue grows in,
>or it will cause a bigger scar than the original wound would.
>For very superficial wounds, where the bond is -only- in dead skin,
>it's not a big problem.
>
> HTH
> geoff steckel
I'm skeptical. For one thing, we use ordinary superglue on dog
surgical wounds and it works great (this is closure of fairly large
wound beds which are leaking heparinized blood). For another, I know
commercial cyanoacrylate "superglue" was being used in Vietnam in the
60's for things like liver trauma (you can't sew liver) and it worked
great there, too. The holdup was not some magic reformulation (though
there may have been minor improvements). The holdup was the FDA and
the medical patent process. Same old, same old.
Steve Harris, M.D.
Fixing small cuts and finger nails with Krazy Glue?
Date: 12 Jan 1999 18:27:31 GMT
Re:"I guess "read the label" means nothing. While I did not get out my
crazy glue, it seems to me that it specifically says not to get it on
your skin. For me, cleaning, putting on some kind of otc stuff to stop
infections, and a bandaid seem easier and safer. Yes, I also heard or
read that there is a special glue that doctors are trying on small wounds
in ERs. That stuff has been tested (I hope) on humans and is used by MDs
not by you or me."
Let's try again to explain it.
The label says not to get it on our skin because it bonds skin. THAT'S WHY WE
WANT TO USE IT ON DAMAGED SKIN. You DON'T dip your finger in Krazy Glue before
picking your nose or going to the bathroom, but you DO dab it into a minor,
clean skin lesion to bond it shut in certain situations.
And such situations include those in which a bandaid won't stay on. Ever try
sailing a wet boat or windsurfer or doing yardwork with bandaids over bloody
blisters on your palms? Doesn't work. A dab of Krazy Glue, 3 minutes' drying
time, and your palms are like new for a couple of days. No blood gets out, no
dirt gets in, and no pain. That's GOOD. Dermatologists RECOMMEND it for such
applications.
A special glue for ERs and small wounds? [Maybe] tested on humans? Heck, the
stuff was DESIGNED for and has been USED IN major surgery for many years. It
BEGAN as surgical cement, and THEN trickled down to K-Mart. The major
differencees (to this discussion) between the stuff surgeons use after a
Caesarean and the stuff Johnny used to glue the cat to the dog are the price,
liability, and FDA approval.
When the new windsurfing season rips the young callouses right off my hands, I
have three choices:
1. Stop sailing for two weeks (and then rip my palms off again anyway).
2. Put on Vaseline, sport bandaids, duct tape, and gloves, try to sail with all
that crap on my hands, change it all twice a day, put up with all the pain and
blood, and hope it doesn't get infected before it heals in a week or two.
3. Slap on some Krazy Glue and NEVER THINK ABOUT AGAIN until this time next
year.
Guess which option windsurfing dermatologists select.
Mike
Search for Google's copy of this article
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Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Fixing small cuts and finger nails with Krazy Glue?
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 15:01:05 GMT
>Just read an article in a health magazine (while waiting at drugstore,
>so don't have the reference) that a new type of "dermaglue" has been
>developed for drs to use in emergency rooms, instead of stitching up
>cuts. They don't plan to market it to us regular people, because the
>substance has to be used carefully. Anyway, the article ended by saying
>that now drs in emergency rooms wouldn't have to continue fixing their
>own cuts by using Krazy Glue. So I guess it is not uncommon.
The stuff is called "Dermabond" and I love it. It allows us to close
wounds in seconds without anesthesia or needles. Quite handy in a
pediatric ER, where a one year-old with a laceration on the face might
previously need to be pharmacologically sedated, which takes a lot of
time, extra staff and monitoring, and is not without risks, so that we
can suture the wound carefully with a tiny needle. With Dermabond,
you simply hold the kid down and glue it shut. No risky medicines, no
needles, and the parents don't have to sit around for an hour waiting
for their kid to wake up.
--
Jonathan R. Fox, M.D.
Super Glue for Repairing Tears
First do a thorough exam to determine the extent of the tear. Then we are off to informed consent. The decision about who, what, when, where, why and how the tear will be repaired Must be meticulous. Then, clean the wound, dry the tissues after placing a piece of gauze into the vagina just deep enough to absorb the lochial flow and keep the perineal area dry. Air drying is ok but a hair dryer is great. Approximate the edges of the tear and apply the glue to either side of the tear and then after pulling the sides together, put on one or two more strips to meld it all together. The strips are thin, not globby! The perineum should be monitored very closely, glue reapplied if there is separation. The glue falls off as a plaque some days later,. It is even more important for the mom to be clean, off her feet, no stairs or car rides, and no tailor sitting. The edges of the tear will not heal properly if the edges are pulled apart. The best healing takes place with any alternative, with mom in bed cuddling and nursing that new baby!
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Just ran across a synopsis of an article from Pediatrics 1996:98:12-14. Some peds emergency depts did a study comparing suturing to Histoacryl Blue (a type of superglue) in repairing pediatric lacerations. There were 30 kids in each group. Time involved in repair was 7 minutes with superglue as opposed to 17 minutes for suturing. Pain during repair was significantly less with superglue and the parents were quite impressed! And, photos the the wounds before and after closure (at 1 wk and 2 months follow-up visits) were assessed by 2 plastic surgeons who were blinded to method of repair. They declared similar or better healing outcomes with superglue. Additionally, because superglue peels off spontaneously in 5-8 days, there is no need for suture removal.
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First of all, the tear needs to be fresh, clean, and fairly shallow with straight edges that lie together on their own. The glue is applied to bridge over the closed edges, not inside on raw surfaces. (Covering the raw surfaces with SuperGlue could actually PREVENT the surfaces from knitting together!) Insert a tampon first and insert your finger between the edges and pull it out to bring the edges forward slightly. This ensures that edges won't roll inward toward each other, but meet perfectly. You could also use a tissue forceps for this. Hold gauze below apex to catch any drips and apply tiny dots of glue sparingly where the edges meet. You can also apply a bead of tiny droplets to bridge the edges. Use a hair dryer or fan to dry, which takes about 30 seconds. The adhesive stiffens as it dries and prolonged soaking isn't too good for it. It will flake off by itself in usually less than a week. Some rare allergic reactions are inflammation and swelling. I learned everything I know about this from one of my favorite teachers, Anne Frye.
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I've just seen the 10 day pp results of my first attempt with supergluing a laceration. She did not want sutures, but wanted to do something about it, so the husband went out and got some OTC superglue. Worked great. Too great. Superglued my glove to her pubic hair, then a gauze pad to her thigh. It does dry as immediately as it does when using it for other things. I was amazed at how it held in spite of the "wetness of the area." The "crusty" of the glued area fell off spontaneously at four days. It looks the same as if it had been sutured, except I do think it healed much faster. The mom is THRILLED, but she talks to a couple of other women who I assisted, one got sutured, one didn't and wishes she had....they want to know why I didn't superglue them!! ;)
I'm sold on the idea enough to try it again when it seems appropriate. My current definition of appropriate is when I look at the laceration and say, "Ooooh, if I only had some tape that would stick...."
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What is your reasoning for using the tissue paper? Is this so you can't overdrip on the tissues?
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Yes, it's all a control issue. I like to hold tissue edges together in a nice apposition and I had too much trouble with gluing my gloves to the repair. Then the repairs would pull apart as I struggled to get free. When I soak a tissue, though, and then glue my glove to the tissue instead, I can pull my glove away, the tissue tears, and I'm free without disturbing the repair.
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Would it work to superglue the perineum after suturing the vaginal vault?? I ask this because it seems less painful. Considering the vault has no nerve endings, I would assume that you could repair without anesthetic or undue pain for the client. Possible or not ???
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I've never used super glue. Do you think that a first degree would heal just as well without it? I'm afraid that I might make the situation worse if I got glue in a place that kept the would edges from healing together. Could you elaborate?
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I do use super glue for 1st degree tears, the gaping kind you look at and say, "Geez, if I could only tape it together for a week." It works wonderfully!!!! I have been considering making it part of the birth supplies list that parents have to acquire...it won't go to waste. They can always use it around the house, and it only costs $2. I do carry the medical super glue, but it is significantly more expensive, and there are times when I run out, and I like to know it's on hand with the parents.
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I get medical super glue from a vet supply house (Jeffers). I think I remember that it has somewhat of a different chem composition...I can't remember exactly what it is, but it's documented somewhere. Honestly, I'm questioning if it's as effective, but generally, it's ok, and I strive to use it more frequently. It is tinted light purple which makes it easier to visualize. It comes with tiny pipettes, so that you can use the same bottle for multiple people. I have no problem, however, with using OTC super glue. There was an article written somewhere QUESTIONING (not proving) if super glue would burn tissues. That has not been my experience. The women do not feel it at all.
As I said, I use super glue for the types of tears which are 1st degree and gaping...the kind that obviously will probably not heal well on their own because the edges are too far apart...the kind you look at and know that if the outside would just sit together, she might heal fine with nothing. The glue does just that...holds the outside together so the insides can heal (tears heal from the inside out).
The idea is not to put the glue into the raw part of the tear. The idea is to create a BRIDGE of glue across the outside surface of the skin (think "taping it together"). I have spilled glue onto the raw parts of the skin, and we have had no detrimental effects, but I can imagine that it would deter healing if those surfaces are coated. I place a fairly think bond, so that she can feel it (but not so thick that it easily peels off). That is part of the healing process for me...if she can feel it tugging when she assumes certain positions, it reminds her to be cautious. For most women, it falls off about day 5-8, just enough time to do its job (if necessary, we redo it). The first few times I used it, the women soaked daily, and the bond stayed intact. Then I started having a few come off (I went and redid it). They all approximated well in the end except one, but it was a hassle to have to go back and redo it. Now, I am experimenting with having women shower only, no soaks, and I have had NONE of the glue come off (but the glue didn't come off in the first few I did who DID soak, so that doesn't say anything). I just tell them it may decrease the likelihood that it will come off, and since these are women who are motivated to heal without large intervention, they agree it's worth it.
As far as holding it in place, I don't really. The super glue works on bottoms as it does on anything else...FAST. I have glued gloves to pubic hair, and I have had a few anuses that got glued shut when the glue dripped down...no big deal...we just clean it off and laugh about it. The glue's a little tough to work with at first, until you understand how it drips. I once found a newer type, a GEL super glue, and I loved it, but I haven't been able to find it lately. It was thicker, so it didn't run off as quickly. You learn to like certain brands with certain applicator tips.
I've had one client on whom it just did not hold...she was Japanese, though I can't imagine that has anything to do with it. I was amazed as I'd already used it several times with great success with other women, and it just would not adhere to her skin. She adamantly refused suturing completely. She did not heal well.
As far as ethics...well, primarily, my ethics start with me and the families I serve. When someone is refusing suturing but is amenable to super glue, it's more ethical to use it than not suture for a tear that needs approximation. I don't see it as a huge risk really. I know there is always the possibility it could become an issue, but as homebirth midwives, we do lots of things that aren't documented in medical literature, and hell, DOCS do lots of things that are not documented in literature (or are clearly documented as poor practice, but they do it anyway). I try to practice carefully, but I don't know of any midwife who does everything by the book...sometimes, the book just ain't written yet and we are ahead of the game! We can't make all our choices based on whether it's been tried and proven, because that is the only way things DO get tried and proven. Anne Frye wrote an article on it a few years back which I am sure one of our more "file-it-away" type midwives here would have.
Some ERs are using it for facial wounds on children, finding less scarring and quicker healing and significantly decreased emotional trauma (at least one study was done). It's a pretty old idea.
Bottom line, the clients LOVE it, and it works. They are so thrilled with the results, and so am I. My birth asst had a baby last month, and she opted for super glue. It fell off at day 2 (she was up way too much), so we re-did it. It worked great, and she is so excited to have learned first-hand a midwifery trick that she can carry with her into her own practice when she becomes a midwife.
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I've now used super glue on two minor 1st degrees with excellent results.
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I recently heard one OB say that it cannot be used on mucous membranes...but au contraire.
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I have used Nexaband for two 2 nd degree tears. Had absolutely wonderful results. Both mothers refused any sutures.
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I've used this stuff a few times, and really like it. It's a snap to use. The way I purchased it, it came from a midwifery supplier (bought at a MANA conference), with syringes so that you could use the same bottle several times without contaminating it. Just fill the syringes with how much you need (a little goes a long way), then take off the needle (if you want) to squirt it on the area to be repaired. I only use it for first degrees (not quite sure I want to rely on it for a muscle repair), that are a little more than superficial. It has worked quite well, and the moms are very happy with it, since there are no stitches or xylocaine involved. The "superglue" eventually sloughs off once tissue starts healing back on its own.
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The company I use the most, Revival, has 3 brands of skin adhesive. Vetbond 3ml #15-251 $12.25, Nexaband liquid 2ml #95-210 $16.95 and Skin Bond 4 oz liquid #95-212 $12.45
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Medical superglue is great. The kind that has been approved for humans has a slightly different chemical composition than the veterinary superglue. I avoid the 3M brand (which I think is Vetbond), because it's exactly the same chemical comp as superglue. If I'm gonna just use superglue, then I'm going to pay superglue prices, not the more expensive vet product prices. Nexaband is a different comp except for one of their products which is the same as the Dermabond that is the human equivalent. Medical superglue has been used for years on humans, though I doubt they've ever done trials on perineal use. They're using it more and more on peds.
It is wonderful for first degree tears that need SOMEthing. I agree that it's not the thing to do for muscle tears, since those will shrink back and not often just heal without being held together. The glue is not placed inside the vault; it's used on the outside only. The ladies on whom I've used it have been so happy to avoid suturing. The glue sloughs off in about 6 days or so...they can even bathe with it. A few times, I've had the glue fall off too soon, so I've just reapplied it...usually, the women have admitted to picking at it or thinking it was dried blood and pulled it off accidentally.
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I know a midwife who cuts up a strip of gauze and uses medical-grade adhesive to glue it in place over the tear - kind of like an iron-on patch, but without the iron. It allows air and fluid to pass through nicely and stays in place for about four days.
ps --as to the question of WHY someone would glue rather than suture: some women absolutely refuses stitches, many midwives are legally prohibited from suturing, glued wounds don't sting as much a sutured wounds when moms urinate, and surgeons report that glued wounds heal very nicely and very quickly, probably faster than sutured wounds.
SuperGlue not for 2nd degree tears
2nd degree tears are, by definition, those which involve some muscle damage. Muscles tend to retract into the tissue on either side and are deep to the surface of the repair, making them totally unsuitable for repair with tissue adhesive. Tissue adhesives are designed to act like a butterfly bandage, one or more thin lines of glue are applied to bridge across the skin surface on either side of the tear (perpendicular to the line of the tear) it should never be placed down inside the tear or applied to both sides of the raw tissue and then pressed together, as you would do if gluing an object because it will form a film that impairs cell regeneration and prevents oxygen from getting to the tissues. Therefore, it is unsuitable for all but the most shallow tears. I agree, in most cases, if tissue adhesive is suitable, so is leaving it to heal on its own. Plus tissue adhesive is full of chemicals. It is glue. Does that really sound like such a swell thing to be putting near raw tissue? Suture is bad enough in this regard.
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Importance of Medical Grade vs. Over-The-Counter Super Glue
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From Anne Frye's Healing Passage, 5th edition, p. 44.:
Tissue adhesive: In 1959, a variety of cyanoacrylate adhesives were developed, some types of which are now used for wound closure in Canada and Europe. Some midwives have assumed that retail cyanoacrylate adhesives such as Super Glue are identical to medical adhesives. However, retail products contain methyl alcohol because it is much cheaper to produce, and are manufactured to industrial, not medical, standards. Cyanoacrylates cure by a chemical reaction called polymerization, which produces heat. Methyl ester has a pronounced heating action when it contacts tissue and may lead to tissue necrosis during metabolism.
Medical grade products contain either butyl, isobutyl or octyl esters. They are bacteriostatic and painless to apply, produce minimal thermal reaction when applied to dry skin and break down harmlessly in tissue. They are essentially inert once dry and have been shown not to be carcinogenic. Butyl products are rigid when dry, but provide a strong bond. Available octyl products are more flexible when dry, but produce a weaker bond. Ideally the wound to be closed is fresh, clean, fairly shallow, with straight edges that lie together on their own. The glue is applied to bridge over the closed edges; it should not be used within the wound, where it will impair epithelization. The only FDA approved adhesives suitable for use as suture alternatives are veterinary products; n-butyl-cyanoacrylate tissue adhesives Vetbond (3M) and Nexaband liquid and octyl-based Nexaband S/C (intended for topical skin closure when deep sutures have been placed). Histoacryl Blue (butyl based) (Davis & Geck) and Tissu-Glu (isobutyl based) (Medi-West Pharmaceuticals) are sold in Canada for human use. DMSO (dimethyl sulfoxide) or acetone serve as removers. (Helmstetter, 1995; Quinn & Kissick, 1994)
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Well, I disagree. Real-life experience (not theory) is that OTC superglue does NOT cause burns or tissue necrosis!! An awful lot of folks have posted here about using OTC superglues-- they haven't posted any experience of burns or necrosis, have they?
Anne's a friend of mine; but even the best of friends can disagree. We've both looked at the same information; we drew different conclusions
Also -- I'm very certain that Anne has never personally used either surgical adhesive OR superglue. I think this is a simple instance of over-emphasis on theory....
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I disagree about the relative importance of using medical grade surgical glue.
While I agree that medical grade super glue is probably (theoretically) superior to the OTC stuff, I do have to defer to the real-life experience of a LARGE number of non-insured Americans who have been using OTC superglue for many years.
I first heard of it years ago from a woman who described how she treated a boy for shallow buckshot wounds. It didn't matter that the boy was an innocent bystander on a school play-yard - the family had no money to pay an emergency room medical bill. So the wounds were washed out -- EXTREMELY WELL!!!! -- and tacked with superglue. I was impressed with the healing when I saw it after a week or so....
Even the outlaws and other "fringe classes" all know the basics of selfgluing -- they make certain the wound is clean and leave a space open for drainage....
OTC superglue is classic folk medicine!
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Used it for the first time at 2 of the most recent births I did. It is SO fantastic!! I sutured with chromic gut in the interior, then closed the exterior by dripping it criss-cross fashion over the exterior. No pain (as outer stitches always hurt/I don't use lidocaine) and it healed beautifully!! I am sold on it.
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Ordering Medical Grade SuperGlue
1-800-JEFFERS
Nexaband wound closure "SuperGlue" cyanoacrylate
item #FACU $7.65 for a 2 ml tube w/extender applicators
Livestock/equine shoulder-length OB gloves (for waterbirth)
item #ATG2 $9.90 for a box of 100
There's a $5 service charge for orders under $50. If you order for a group of midwives, you can order 2 boxes of gloves and 4 tubes of Nexaband for just over $50, to avoid the service charge.
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From: (Steven B. Harris)
Subject: Re: Dr. Weil
Date: 17 May 1997
>
>>> Dr. Weil is also amazing. This man has
>changed my life, and I can also guarantee the same promise from
>THOUSANDSIs this the same Dr. Weil who feels that cracked skin on the heels is due
>to the dry atmosphere (he suffers from it himself), and recommends that
>superglue be used to bind the edges together? He also recommended using
>superglue to bind the edges of cuts. Guess we have to sift the wheat
>from the chaff.
Superglue was used by trauma surgeons in Vietnam to glue the edges
of lacerated livers together (ever try to SEW liver?). Works great.
It also works perfectly fine in normal skin wounds, and is non-toxic.
The only reason it hasn't been approved by the FDA for this purpose is
that the studies would cost millions, and who's going to pay them?
Superglue has long since passed off-patent.
I work occasionally at a private research lab which does
experimental surgical research on animals. In dogs, we had a lot of
problem with oozing and infection at sites where arterial catheters
were left in. Now we superglue them and all that problem is gone. The
glue doesn't interfere with healing, and it seals excellently. It is
as resistent to abscessing as staples, and seals far better. For
wounds in animals which have been anticoagulated, it's a godsend.
Survival animals which have catheters pulled later suffer no ill
effects, and the wounds heal fine.
Weil has many areas where he's out to lunch, but superglue isn't one
of them.
Steve Harris, M.D.
Search for Google's copy of this article
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From: (Steven B. Harris)
Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Wounds requiring stitching and Coloskin
Date: 19 Dec 1998 07:00:52 GMT
>>Basically it's just "Super Glue" (cyano-something-or-other). If there
>>really is a difference between the hardware store version and the much
>>more expensive medical version, I don't know what it is.
>
>You'd probably have to ask on sci.chem exactly what the difference
>is, but this is the basis:
>
>Superglue as normally formulated is either too good or not good enough. A
>healing wound requires an elastic and permeable seal. Superglue from the
>hardware store is too stiff and makes a fairly impermeable seal. It has
>taken a very long time (20 years? longer?) to discover a modification to
>superglue which allows the wound to breathe without being too weak to
>hold well.
>
>The glue bond also has to degrade in the skin as new tissue grows in,
>or it will cause a bigger scar than the original wound would.
>For very superficial wounds, where the bond is -only- in dead skin,
>it's not a big problem.
>
> HTH
> geoff steckel
I'm skeptical. For one thing, we use ordinary superglue on dog
surgical wounds and it works great (this is closure of fairly large
wound beds which are leaking heparinized blood). For another, I know
commercial cyanoacrylate "superglue" was being used in Vietnam in the
60's for things like liver trauma (you can't sew liver) and it worked
great there, too. The holdup was not some magic reformulation (though
there may have been minor improvements). The holdup was the FDA and
the medical patent process. Same old, same old.
Steve Harris, M.D.
Fixing small cuts and finger nails with Krazy Glue?
Date: 12 Jan 1999 18:27:31 GMT
Re:"I guess "read the label" means nothing. While I did not get out my
crazy glue, it seems to me that it specifically says not to get it on
your skin. For me, cleaning, putting on some kind of otc stuff to stop
infections, and a bandaid seem easier and safer. Yes, I also heard or
read that there is a special glue that doctors are trying on small wounds
in ERs. That stuff has been tested (I hope) on humans and is used by MDs
not by you or me."
Let's try again to explain it.
The label says not to get it on our skin because it bonds skin. THAT'S WHY WE
WANT TO USE IT ON DAMAGED SKIN. You DON'T dip your finger in Krazy Glue before
picking your nose or going to the bathroom, but you DO dab it into a minor,
clean skin lesion to bond it shut in certain situations.
And such situations include those in which a bandaid won't stay on. Ever try
sailing a wet boat or windsurfer or doing yardwork with bandaids over bloody
blisters on your palms? Doesn't work. A dab of Krazy Glue, 3 minutes' drying
time, and your palms are like new for a couple of days. No blood gets out, no
dirt gets in, and no pain. That's GOOD. Dermatologists RECOMMEND it for such
applications.
A special glue for ERs and small wounds? [Maybe] tested on humans? Heck, the
stuff was DESIGNED for and has been USED IN major surgery for many years. It
BEGAN as surgical cement, and THEN trickled down to K-Mart. The major
differencees (to this discussion) between the stuff surgeons use after a
Caesarean and the stuff Johnny used to glue the cat to the dog are the price,
liability, and FDA approval.
When the new windsurfing season rips the young callouses right off my hands, I
have three choices:
1. Stop sailing for two weeks (and then rip my palms off again anyway).
2. Put on Vaseline, sport bandaids, duct tape, and gloves, try to sail with all
that crap on my hands, change it all twice a day, put up with all the pain and
blood, and hope it doesn't get infected before it heals in a week or two.
3. Slap on some Krazy Glue and NEVER THINK ABOUT AGAIN until this time next
year.
Guess which option windsurfing dermatologists select.
Mike
Search for Google's copy of this article
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Newsgroups: sci.med
Subject: Re: Fixing small cuts and finger nails with Krazy Glue?
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 15:01:05 GMT
>Just read an article in a health magazine (while waiting at drugstore,
>so don't have the reference) that a new type of "dermaglue" has been
>developed for drs to use in emergency rooms, instead of stitching up
>cuts. They don't plan to market it to us regular people, because the
>substance has to be used carefully. Anyway, the article ended by saying
>that now drs in emergency rooms wouldn't have to continue fixing their
>own cuts by using Krazy Glue. So I guess it is not uncommon.
The stuff is called "Dermabond" and I love it. It allows us to close
wounds in seconds without anesthesia or needles. Quite handy in a
pediatric ER, where a one year-old with a laceration on the face might
previously need to be pharmacologically sedated, which takes a lot of
time, extra staff and monitoring, and is not without risks, so that we
can suture the wound carefully with a tiny needle. With Dermabond,
you simply hold the kid down and glue it shut. No risky medicines, no
needles, and the parents don't have to sit around for an hour waiting
for their kid to wake up.
--
Jonathan R. Fox, M.D.
rhalpin last decade
Hello everyone. I posted messages on this forum a few months back saying I had done the same as all of you, trying everything and was not healing. I ENDED UP IN THE HOSPITAL with diabetic kitoacidosis (a few points away from a coma). I was diagnosed with insulin-dependent, type 1 diabetes, which means that my body no longer produces insulin, and my body was STARVED for nutrients, leading me to dehydration and the vaginal tearing along with hemorroids. Type 1 is genetic, and a small percentage of people get it. BUT, type 2, usually caused by poor diet, also causes the body to be dehydrated. Consider the fact that you might be pre-diabetic or diabetic if you are having a hard time healing. I'm not saying you all have diabetes-- but consider having your blood sugar tested before you eat, and 2 hours after you eat to see if it is normal. If you are, you might need diabetes medicine or insulin (depending on how bad you are). Insulin-inhalers are now out, so needles aren't the only option anymore! Don't be afraid, just consider the option, and get tested just in case.
jelybeen last decade
I forgot to mention that right after being in the hospital, and being re-hydrated and given insulin, over-night, my body was healed, and I no longer had hemmoroids or vaginal fissures.
jelybeen last decade
Hello Everyone,
I've been having trouble with a very bothersome vaginal tear for close to 2 years now. I've also been reading this forum periodically but somehow never contributed.
I recently noticed Jeanne's post w/ mention of surgery as an option. I actually did go in for surgery to address this problem about 6 months ago. My doctor cut and removed old scar tissue and then stiched the opening. I had to go back a couple weeks later and have the stitches removed and I abstained from having sex w/ my boyfriend for 6 weeks thereafter.
Unfortunately, I am no better now. My doctor claims that everything looks fine and normal yet - every time I have sex - it hurts for days after and the skin is very sore to the touch. According to my doctor, the scar tissue has stretched and that is why there is tenderness but the original tear has not reopened.
At this point, I'm at a loss. I have no idea how to make this better. I have tried the Premarin cream w/ no luck and been tested for all STD's. I'm thinking of getting a second opinion from another gynecologist. I have not tried any of the homeopathis remedies mentioned on this site but I am going to try those as well.
Having said all that, I'd suggest avoiding surgery as it is painful and costly and seemingly not very helpful. Perhaps, if I had waited longer than 6 weeks to have sex it would've healed more properly.
Any thoughts/advice?
Thanks!
I've been having trouble with a very bothersome vaginal tear for close to 2 years now. I've also been reading this forum periodically but somehow never contributed.
I recently noticed Jeanne's post w/ mention of surgery as an option. I actually did go in for surgery to address this problem about 6 months ago. My doctor cut and removed old scar tissue and then stiched the opening. I had to go back a couple weeks later and have the stitches removed and I abstained from having sex w/ my boyfriend for 6 weeks thereafter.
Unfortunately, I am no better now. My doctor claims that everything looks fine and normal yet - every time I have sex - it hurts for days after and the skin is very sore to the touch. According to my doctor, the scar tissue has stretched and that is why there is tenderness but the original tear has not reopened.
At this point, I'm at a loss. I have no idea how to make this better. I have tried the Premarin cream w/ no luck and been tested for all STD's. I'm thinking of getting a second opinion from another gynecologist. I have not tried any of the homeopathis remedies mentioned on this site but I am going to try those as well.
Having said all that, I'd suggest avoiding surgery as it is painful and costly and seemingly not very helpful. Perhaps, if I had waited longer than 6 weeks to have sex it would've healed more properly.
Any thoughts/advice?
Thanks!
bgirl last decade
Try a single dose of Bellis 10M
walkin last decade
Hello everyone,
I have been reading all the posts in this forum with great interest as like a few of you I have been desperately seeking advice regarding vaginal tears. I am certainly willing to try a few of the remedies suggested, I simply wanted to know if any of the earlier posts have now found something that has healed the tear and if so how quickly it did so?
Many thanks
I have been reading all the posts in this forum with great interest as like a few of you I have been desperately seeking advice regarding vaginal tears. I am certainly willing to try a few of the remedies suggested, I simply wanted to know if any of the earlier posts have now found something that has healed the tear and if so how quickly it did so?
Many thanks
Tinyflower last decade
hi I'd like to give the nitricum a try but can't order the pilules on this website. there are tablets for sale - would i take the same number of those as the pilules? or would a cream applied directly be better?
this is a really helpful thread - like many of you I'm fed up and have concerns about high steroid use.thanks for all the advice!
this is a really helpful thread - like many of you I'm fed up and have concerns about high steroid use.thanks for all the advice!
indie_chick last decade
Hi Jeanne-
This is what has helped me. Sorry other people, its not homeopathic, only my experience, so skip this post if you want homeop. information.
Sitting/lying in the sunshine- I mean with the tear right there in the sunshine (thru a window is fine) for about 20 min, 2-3 times a day or however often you feel inclined.
Raw honey applied several times a day after peeing. Amazing!
I would avoid estrogen cream bc of the association with increased breast/uterine cancer. See www.johnleemd.com for more info. Maybe progesterone would help?
I *would* persue a homeopathic cure, bc it seems odd that your skin there is not healing and homeop. has worked well for me with "odd" things.
Also- consider the mind-body connection and that your tear could be waiting on something to heal. Do a little meditation...Ask the tear what purpose it is serving or trying to serve for you. OR- What is the message it is bringing? OR- What does it need? Answers may not come right away but they will come if you want 'em. Just a thought based on my own experience. Good luck, tho!
Rebecca
This is what has helped me. Sorry other people, its not homeopathic, only my experience, so skip this post if you want homeop. information.
Sitting/lying in the sunshine- I mean with the tear right there in the sunshine (thru a window is fine) for about 20 min, 2-3 times a day or however often you feel inclined.
Raw honey applied several times a day after peeing. Amazing!
I would avoid estrogen cream bc of the association with increased breast/uterine cancer. See www.johnleemd.com for more info. Maybe progesterone would help?
I *would* persue a homeopathic cure, bc it seems odd that your skin there is not healing and homeop. has worked well for me with "odd" things.
Also- consider the mind-body connection and that your tear could be waiting on something to heal. Do a little meditation...Ask the tear what purpose it is serving or trying to serve for you. OR- What is the message it is bringing? OR- What does it need? Answers may not come right away but they will come if you want 'em. Just a thought based on my own experience. Good luck, tho!
Rebecca
Rebecca last decade
has anyone answered this post with a direct response and experience with actually healing the tear? I want a solution so badly.
loola last decade
I used lots of lube during sex to keep the tears from getting worse (ky gel seems to be our favorite), and A&D ointment to heal myself. Sometimes the area gets tender and I just use the lube and ointment, but after about 5 months I seem to be feeling generally much better.
Nina21 last decade
indie_chick last decade
I'm so sorry- I read through the post but there are many tablets suggested so I'm not sure which one you're talking about now. Bellis? Nitricum? I went to the health food store but they didn't have either.
Thank you and I apologize if I'm making someone repeat themselves.
Thank you and I apologize if I'm making someone repeat themselves.
loola last decade
Please go to page 2 of this thread, entry dated 2005-8-18, from sahai. Gradually reduce the frequency as improvement sets in.
sahai last decade
well I don't know if maybe my story is a little more severe (I tried to read all the posts but skimmed through the ones in the middle). I had a vaginal tear, a very serious one that led to major loss of blood (i passed out). So please please make sure you go to a doctor and get yours checked out. I had laser surgery, it just took a few minutes and I have had no pain during follow up. Of course I have yet to see if there will be lingering pain in the future, but, believe me, the amount of blood I was losing (I now have anemia) was traumatizing, upsetting, and dangerous to my health. Please check all your options. if your tear is not improving with creams and tablets, and you continuously bleed, talk to your doctor. I had general anaesthesia but I believe that in the US you could probably request and get local. good luck to all.
chamey last decade
Hello,
I empathize with you and your situation dealing with vaginal tears. First, there is no quick fix solution for a tear in this area. But you may find this tip helpful. A tear at the top of the vagina near the urethra a.k.a.(periurethral laceration)do not involve muscle, just tissue. These type of tears heal faster than one that involves muscle. These tears may require stitches or not and you can get dissolvable stitches if asked for through your Dr. The main complaint for this type of tear is pain on urination. Treatment: Buy a peri-bottle
It's a bottle with a pull up top that you can squeeze liguids into the perineal area. Fill the peri-bottle with 2 tablespoons of baking soda and warm water. When you urinate squeeze the solution into the perineal area while sitting to immediately rinse away the urine.After you have finished urinating pat the area dry with a white towel. And use a blow dryer on a cool setting to dry the tear. Main concern: PREVENT INFECTION Increase your intake of Vitamin E&C during your healing process.Vitamin E promotes healthy skin and Vitamin C will boost your immune system to prevent infection. Purchase over internet a spray called Dermoplast which is hospital strength(blue and white can with red hospital symbol on it .Will cost you around $6-$7 a can. This spray is used to soothe pain and contains a moisturizer with aloe and lanolin. (A GODsend) If you are like me anything with harsh chemicals will make you fly through the roof at this point so I'm only using natural products. Do not use Petroleum based products as this will harbor bacteria. You may use the spray as needed throughout the day so carry it with you in your purse. And just sit back and let your body do the healing.
This is Not a cure. Just a solution that will ease your problem. Abstain from sexual intercourse from 4-6 weeks and keep the area dry as possible. Let it air out- meaning no panties for more than 2-6 hours a day. And if you feel the area getting moist just use the peri-bottle solution and use the blow dryer on cool setting to dry the area as needed. As with any condition different people may have like symptoms but different causes and this is no substitute for a checkup through your regular physician. We as women must understand that we are not 20 forever and understand that our bodies undergo many changes throughout our lives and we must think positive and believe that our bodies can heal naturally but we must be patient and stop buying 'Quick -fixes' with harsh chemicals that only make our condition worse. This is a painful thing and what you need is relief and hopefully this will provide some relief for you. Write back and let me know if this helps. Best wishes for all of you.
I empathize with you and your situation dealing with vaginal tears. First, there is no quick fix solution for a tear in this area. But you may find this tip helpful. A tear at the top of the vagina near the urethra a.k.a.(periurethral laceration)do not involve muscle, just tissue. These type of tears heal faster than one that involves muscle. These tears may require stitches or not and you can get dissolvable stitches if asked for through your Dr. The main complaint for this type of tear is pain on urination. Treatment: Buy a peri-bottle
It's a bottle with a pull up top that you can squeeze liguids into the perineal area. Fill the peri-bottle with 2 tablespoons of baking soda and warm water. When you urinate squeeze the solution into the perineal area while sitting to immediately rinse away the urine.After you have finished urinating pat the area dry with a white towel. And use a blow dryer on a cool setting to dry the tear. Main concern: PREVENT INFECTION Increase your intake of Vitamin E&C during your healing process.Vitamin E promotes healthy skin and Vitamin C will boost your immune system to prevent infection. Purchase over internet a spray called Dermoplast which is hospital strength(blue and white can with red hospital symbol on it .Will cost you around $6-$7 a can. This spray is used to soothe pain and contains a moisturizer with aloe and lanolin. (A GODsend) If you are like me anything with harsh chemicals will make you fly through the roof at this point so I'm only using natural products. Do not use Petroleum based products as this will harbor bacteria. You may use the spray as needed throughout the day so carry it with you in your purse. And just sit back and let your body do the healing.
This is Not a cure. Just a solution that will ease your problem. Abstain from sexual intercourse from 4-6 weeks and keep the area dry as possible. Let it air out- meaning no panties for more than 2-6 hours a day. And if you feel the area getting moist just use the peri-bottle solution and use the blow dryer on cool setting to dry the area as needed. As with any condition different people may have like symptoms but different causes and this is no substitute for a checkup through your regular physician. We as women must understand that we are not 20 forever and understand that our bodies undergo many changes throughout our lives and we must think positive and believe that our bodies can heal naturally but we must be patient and stop buying 'Quick -fixes' with harsh chemicals that only make our condition worse. This is a painful thing and what you need is relief and hopefully this will provide some relief for you. Write back and let me know if this helps. Best wishes for all of you.
EP4038 last decade
1. Age -29
2. Sex - f
3. country - usa
4. climate - humid
5. current complain - vaginal tear on labia minora
6. current medicine you are taking - none
7. sign & Symptom of disease - irritation, pain.
My complaint: I went to a spa to get a brazilian wax, and the person got some wax on my labia and when she removed the wax, I noticed abnormal pain, burning, for two weeks, then i took a look and noticed that my labia minora was torn. i went to the gyno and he told me to put KY on it and then it would heal by itself. So far no healing yet. Can anyone suggest a remedy? Also, can anyone say if the spa can be held liable? Has anyone ever experienced this before?
Please help!
Thanks in advance.
SG
2. Sex - f
3. country - usa
4. climate - humid
5. current complain - vaginal tear on labia minora
6. current medicine you are taking - none
7. sign & Symptom of disease - irritation, pain.
My complaint: I went to a spa to get a brazilian wax, and the person got some wax on my labia and when she removed the wax, I noticed abnormal pain, burning, for two weeks, then i took a look and noticed that my labia minora was torn. i went to the gyno and he told me to put KY on it and then it would heal by itself. So far no healing yet. Can anyone suggest a remedy? Also, can anyone say if the spa can be held liable? Has anyone ever experienced this before?
Please help!
Thanks in advance.
SG
somerlee last decade
I would like to that sahai for being so helpful. I'd actually like to thank all of you for sharing your stories. Now I'd like to share mine...
On 11/10/06, I developed a tear at the 6 o'clock spot. It was caused by my partner's size (at least a nurse practicioner told me so). I am extrememly lubricated naturally with him so it wasn't that, plus we don't really engage in rough sex often. Anway, the tear kept reoccurring until it got really swollen and appeared to be herpes. I went to my Gyn. and she tested me (results were all negative) and told me just by looking at it that it was clearly not herpes. Just swollen tissue caused by a vaginal fissure. She told me to take L-Lysine and prescribed me Lotrisone Cream. I have been taking them faithfully to no avail. I also have not been able to stop having sex (although it is quite painful). I may stop for a week or so, but then I give in.
I just ordered the Nitricum Acidum and should receive it Wed. or Thurs. I will keep you updated on my progress (or lack there of). I will also try my best to avoid sex for at least a full 2 weeks (hopefully more like 4 to 6, but it depends on the healing process). I pray that this works. I do not want to have to endure this for years to come. I plan for this man to be my last partner and it sucks that he is larger than what I am used to.
Again, I'll keep you posted!!!
On 11/10/06, I developed a tear at the 6 o'clock spot. It was caused by my partner's size (at least a nurse practicioner told me so). I am extrememly lubricated naturally with him so it wasn't that, plus we don't really engage in rough sex often. Anway, the tear kept reoccurring until it got really swollen and appeared to be herpes. I went to my Gyn. and she tested me (results were all negative) and told me just by looking at it that it was clearly not herpes. Just swollen tissue caused by a vaginal fissure. She told me to take L-Lysine and prescribed me Lotrisone Cream. I have been taking them faithfully to no avail. I also have not been able to stop having sex (although it is quite painful). I may stop for a week or so, but then I give in.
I just ordered the Nitricum Acidum and should receive it Wed. or Thurs. I will keep you updated on my progress (or lack there of). I will also try my best to avoid sex for at least a full 2 weeks (hopefully more like 4 to 6, but it depends on the healing process). I pray that this works. I do not want to have to endure this for years to come. I plan for this man to be my last partner and it sucks that he is larger than what I am used to.
Again, I'll keep you posted!!!
ajd22 last decade
It's me again. As for my update, I began taking it on Thursday, December 28th. I took a bit more than Sahai suggested, but it seemed to heal me pretty quickly.
I had sex on January 2nd with the same partner. To both of our surprises, I did not split! That's not to say that I will not in the future, but I haven't yet. To be honest though, I felt kind of healed already...
Sometimes when I tear and it hurts so bad for a while, if I have sex (regardless of the pain), it seems to heal me. I know that sounds weird, but for me sex has helped speed up the process. But continued sex worsens it to the point that I refuse to have sex until I heal a little more.
Anyway, I hope I serve as a testimony that the Nitric Acis works. I ordered it from this site and from another one in India. I must say that the one from this site is much easier to take becuse it has less alcohol in it. I take the dilution and drop 4 to 5 globules under my tongue. I let it sit there then swallow. I did this 4 to 6 times daily. I no longer take it as much. Maybe once a day if that.
Thanks to this site and to the woman who started this thread!!! And also a big thanks to Sahai!!! =)
I had sex on January 2nd with the same partner. To both of our surprises, I did not split! That's not to say that I will not in the future, but I haven't yet. To be honest though, I felt kind of healed already...
Sometimes when I tear and it hurts so bad for a while, if I have sex (regardless of the pain), it seems to heal me. I know that sounds weird, but for me sex has helped speed up the process. But continued sex worsens it to the point that I refuse to have sex until I heal a little more.
Anyway, I hope I serve as a testimony that the Nitric Acis works. I ordered it from this site and from another one in India. I must say that the one from this site is much easier to take becuse it has less alcohol in it. I take the dilution and drop 4 to 5 globules under my tongue. I let it sit there then swallow. I did this 4 to 6 times daily. I no longer take it as much. Maybe once a day if that.
Thanks to this site and to the woman who started this thread!!! And also a big thanks to Sahai!!! =)
ajd22 last decade
Hi everyone
Just found this forum! I'm so glad to find I'm not the only one!
I have suffered from a vaginal tear for over 3 years now. The pain started from my first sexual experience and I've been with the same partner ever since. I have been sent back and forth from one gyno to the other, who couldn't figure out what was wrong with me. All my tests were negative but I was still given all sorts of medicines, creams and so forth but the last dr i went to see finally saw the tear and now shes suggested a really strong steroid cream. (Dermovate)
She did warn me about using them (thinning skin), but said as I am only to apply a really small amount (about the size of 2 small pinheads to the tear) that it would be ok. So her diagnosis has been this steroid cream and to wash with Aqueous cream (no soap, this is my new soap and is not irritating!). I have to say the area looks a bit better (2 days in) but I can still feel that it is raw. I am to use the cream for 2 weeks, no sex, but after 2 weeks I have to try having intercourse with lots of Lubrication. When I mean lots she said really messy, messy sex!! as in squirt half the tube out! And to repeat the 2 weeks if the area splits open again.
For those saying the area has to be dried out, please do not dry your vulval area out. It will make the tear form scar tissue, and scars as we all know forms hard tissue, this in turn will tear this area more and make the tear bigger, you need the skin to heal but for it to keep its elasticity! You have to keep the area moist but to promote healing in that area, gently massage your vulvar area from the outside of your outer lips not on the inside at least twice a day, this will ensure more blood flow and platelets to heal the area. Tears are a slow process to heal but with patience and abstinence, hard though it is, I think we can get through this!!!
I read about the nitric acid, I tried arnica already and for me it did not work. I will try nitric acid, as directed by sahaa, and hope to have the same sucess as ajd22!! Thank you for updating, you've given me some hope!
I too will update as soon as I start the nitric acid treatment and let you all know how its going!
Thanks to all those who have started and kept this forum going, I was starting to lose all hope!! :)
Hope to update soon!!!!
Just found this forum! I'm so glad to find I'm not the only one!
I have suffered from a vaginal tear for over 3 years now. The pain started from my first sexual experience and I've been with the same partner ever since. I have been sent back and forth from one gyno to the other, who couldn't figure out what was wrong with me. All my tests were negative but I was still given all sorts of medicines, creams and so forth but the last dr i went to see finally saw the tear and now shes suggested a really strong steroid cream. (Dermovate)
She did warn me about using them (thinning skin), but said as I am only to apply a really small amount (about the size of 2 small pinheads to the tear) that it would be ok. So her diagnosis has been this steroid cream and to wash with Aqueous cream (no soap, this is my new soap and is not irritating!). I have to say the area looks a bit better (2 days in) but I can still feel that it is raw. I am to use the cream for 2 weeks, no sex, but after 2 weeks I have to try having intercourse with lots of Lubrication. When I mean lots she said really messy, messy sex!! as in squirt half the tube out! And to repeat the 2 weeks if the area splits open again.
For those saying the area has to be dried out, please do not dry your vulval area out. It will make the tear form scar tissue, and scars as we all know forms hard tissue, this in turn will tear this area more and make the tear bigger, you need the skin to heal but for it to keep its elasticity! You have to keep the area moist but to promote healing in that area, gently massage your vulvar area from the outside of your outer lips not on the inside at least twice a day, this will ensure more blood flow and platelets to heal the area. Tears are a slow process to heal but with patience and abstinence, hard though it is, I think we can get through this!!!
I read about the nitric acid, I tried arnica already and for me it did not work. I will try nitric acid, as directed by sahaa, and hope to have the same sucess as ajd22!! Thank you for updating, you've given me some hope!
I too will update as soon as I start the nitric acid treatment and let you all know how its going!
Thanks to all those who have started and kept this forum going, I was starting to lose all hope!! :)
Hope to update soon!!!!
Relena last decade
Hi everyone. My name is Jeannette, Im 21 and my vaginal concern is a little different. My Gyno did a biopsy and removed the tear and the area around it about 2 months ago. My boyfriend and I waited weeks to have sex but when we did, the spot that was cut out hurt. I used a steroid for a while but everytime we have sex it just starts to bleed a little and it just wont heal.It only hurts when he first penetrates me but I get really wet so I dont feel it after that. It has been months and it seems that it will never heal...
NettiePair last decade
Ok hi everyone
its been 2 weeks now since being given treatment with steroid cream and aqueous cream and one week of using the Nitric acid.
The area healed!! My tear was 3/4 inch long and 1cm wide which was quite big and it mended itself slowly. I did have sex after the 2 week period using half a tube of Lubrication (KY Jelly), the first time was pain free (yay!), but unfortunately as the area is still,quite weak, it has torn a little again but only 3mm both ways and I got another tear 3mm long at the 12 o'clock position, which was after another 3 sessions of sex. I am suspecting, that I am quite petite down there! I am extremely happy to to say that Nitricum acidum and the doctors treatment combined have resulted in excellent progress of healing me up. And I will be repeating the treatment as directed by my doctor and nitricum acidum by sahai for another 2 weeks. This should help continue healing the area up and encourage some more strengthening in my tissues down there.
So I hope I am too, an example that nitricum acidum works. Thank you Sahai and adj22! :)
Good luck people! And if you live in the uk, I suggest visiting a GUM clinic near you and ask to be refered to a specialist for the vulval area. They are wonderful gyno's even if it takes a month to see them, better late than never!
its been 2 weeks now since being given treatment with steroid cream and aqueous cream and one week of using the Nitric acid.
The area healed!! My tear was 3/4 inch long and 1cm wide which was quite big and it mended itself slowly. I did have sex after the 2 week period using half a tube of Lubrication (KY Jelly), the first time was pain free (yay!), but unfortunately as the area is still,quite weak, it has torn a little again but only 3mm both ways and I got another tear 3mm long at the 12 o'clock position, which was after another 3 sessions of sex. I am suspecting, that I am quite petite down there! I am extremely happy to to say that Nitricum acidum and the doctors treatment combined have resulted in excellent progress of healing me up. And I will be repeating the treatment as directed by my doctor and nitricum acidum by sahai for another 2 weeks. This should help continue healing the area up and encourage some more strengthening in my tissues down there.
So I hope I am too, an example that nitricum acidum works. Thank you Sahai and adj22! :)
Good luck people! And if you live in the uk, I suggest visiting a GUM clinic near you and ask to be refered to a specialist for the vulval area. They are wonderful gyno's even if it takes a month to see them, better late than never!
Relena last decade
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