Derealization- feelings of unreality _{Page 15 of 19}

Hey, Veronicavix...if you are interested in deepak chopra I suggest starting with his book How to Know God. He mixes spirituality and science to explain his view. It really struck a chord with me, especially the whole fear of being a brain thing.

This is for everyone here...do any of you make exercise a part of your lifestyle? If you don't, start now (but slowly). I run and/or work with weights everyday. It's one of the best things you can do for yourself physically and spiritually.

have any of you guys tried the linden method?? does it work? it seems too good to be true....

Hi tuffy45,

i actually tried it and it actually helped me to relax and to calm down. I recommend it if you think that there is something wrong with physically (heart attack or stroke or tumor...something). It includes a lot of meditation tracks to relax and talks about the diet to minimize your anxiety symptoms, describes symptoms, assuring that you dont have any serious deseases...tells you how to get off of meds and how he went through his illness...pretty amazing stuff. hope this helps let me know if you have any more questions and hope it helps if you decide to get it.

god bless

Hi all,
re : do any of you make exercise a part of your lifestyle:

Yes, I do. I have a great DVD I use to walk at home. It includes toning and aerobics. It's about 50 minutes of target heart rate. Afterwards I feel so much better. Even if I feel groggy, I still put in the DVD and I'll start doing a bit. And after a few minutes I really get in it. It definitely boosts my mood.
Good suggestion!

Hi again,
re: exercise

I forgot to mention that exercise is also a great way to burn off stress. In fact, I really noticed my anxiety went way down when I started doing toning with the stretch band thingy and some hand weights.

It really seems to almost eliminate anxiety. And stretching is also important after :-)

But even going for a walk can do a world of good.

Hi all again,
I've never heard of the Linden method. It sounds interesting.

I use Centerpointe Research Institute Technology: Holosynch. It's also very cool. It uses really low frequencies embedded in a CD (with some nice rain sounds and soft gongs) to create new neural pathways in your brain that allow you to break free of old thought processes. Very interesting.

sunnyisorange, where did you find this cd?

Hey everyone, I came across a couple of past posts (years old) that some you of might have read. For now though I want to ask you guys about living and dying. Without saying anymore I just want to ask simply BEFORE dp/dr have any of you had a fear of death but were also living a life that you didn't enjoy, so much so that you really didn't want to be alive either?
Please be as open and honest and expanisve on this as you can.

yes, it's hard to be expansive on this but yes before i started experiencing th dr/dp i was going through a depression and did feel suicidal. i knew that i would never actually commit suicide for a few reasons, one of those being my fear of death, or my anxieties of not existing after death to be more specific. after the worst part of my depression past i started doing drugs, then stopped.. and it was after that when i started the feeling of dr/dp.. but i have to wonder if it was the drugs or the depression that brought it on?
has anyone started feeling dr/dp after going through a depression? i think its very possible that comming out of such a sad and dark state of mind brought on the feeling of derealization. it makes sense that anyone would see the world a little sketchier aftr going through a bad depression.

Hi Veronicavix,

Do you mean the holosync cd? or the exercise DVD?

I'll answer both

the holosync cd:
I found about the program from my Mom. I'll try to give you the email address...
support at (use the ampersand symbol) centerpointe dot com.

You'll find the info.
The founder, Bill Harris, patented this technology about 10 or 15 years ago. I'm not sure. So, it's totally unique. He uses a kind of technology that imbeds very low frequencies into a soundtrack. You can't hear these sounds. You can only hear the rain sounds, and the gentle gongs.

In the first 30 minutes it'll take your brain waves into beta, (Or alpha, can't remember :-))

This is a very relaxed state. I get really creative in this state, I get ideas, or I visualize solutions to my problems.

Anyway, the frequencies are different in the left and right ears. And so what happens is your brain tries to reconcile the two frequencies and this causes your brain to re-structure itself so to speak. That is, it must create new neural pathways in order to process the frequencies...

There are 12 levels. I'm on level 5. Each level takes about a month or two months to complete. Once you get up to level 5, it takes a year!

With each level, the frequencies get progressively lower. What this does to your brain is it allows you to gain a really heightened awareness of your brain activity...ie, it helps you to become the observer or witness of your thoughts.

Why is this useful? Well, the more you can become the witness of your brain 'static' or repetitive conditioned thoughts, the less they bother you. You can get free of your old, mostly unconcious ways of thinking, and begin to replace them positive ones.

Many users have reported a lifting away of depression, anxiety, fears etc. It even works with people who have impaired hearing.

And the ultimate goal is to have a better life and not always be led around by unconscious negative thoughts.

You get free support too from qualified people. There's lots of other good stuff. He has a blog, there are lots of cool seminars by other people who do related things...he recommends good books etc.

BTW, I've seen a few CDs on the internet that offer a similar service. But they don't have the patented technology that Bill invented, which is, they can't keep lowering the frequencies. They only take you to the first state, the alpha one or beta, again, I'm not sure.

But Bill's technology can take you deeper into beta and theta. In theta, it's the state of meditation that monks strive for.

And each level takes you into an even deeper state of alpha, beta and theta. It's really cool! The reason you have to do it slowly is because your brain can't handle going to such brain wave states. Bill tried it at the beginning when he was experimenting with the technology, and it had undesirable effects. It gives your brain to much all at once. Like trying to run a marathon without training for it.

Anyway, it's so exciting to use it. It also releases those relaxation chemical in your brain...the dopamines. You feel soooo relaxed, like you've slept for several hours, and yet, you were completely awake.

It also gets rid of cortisol and other stress related chemical in your body, so it also has an anti-aging effect.

Basically, it's like doing meditation. But, you need to put on the headphones and you can get the same benefits as monks who have been meditating all their lives...I know it sounds unreal. But it's true. :-)

I really recommend this for anyone who's struggling with depression or anxiety etc.

As for the exercise DVD...I found it on collagevideo dot com. There are over a hundred at-home exercise videos to choose from.

Hi all,

I made a typo:

I meant: the reason you have to do it slowly is because your brain can't handle going to such *low* brain wave states *so quickly*
...sorry.

Hi all,

OOOOPS! I made another mistake. :-) The email for information about the holosync Cd's was wrong.

Here is the right one:

centerpointe 'dot' com

sorry about that.

Hi, I just check the site, and I want to add that:

the first 4 levels take 4 to 6 months to complete. Not 1 or 2. Sorry about that. It's been a while since I did them. I started around 4 years ago.

I was also depressed, questioning the meaning if life, felt like life had no meaning, and yet was afraid of death etc....

But it's really helped me.
:-)

hey y'all, the reason I asked earlier about living and dying was because of a post someone wrote years ago. I've perused the pages of this this thread before but somehow missed this one particular post. For me it is extremely inspiring. If you haven't already seen it, it is on page 3 under the name Tangy. This is someone who had been living with dp/dr for 25 years! However after reading a prior post on page 2 something clicked in him and he was able to 'burst' his dp/dr 'bubble.'
If you haven't already seen this, check it out (plus the posts on page 2 that inspired him)

Sunnyisorange- thankyou, really. i appreciate your concern. are you still suffering from this or have you recovered or learning to? sorry i think i might have missed a few posts.

i forgot my age a few days ago. like really seriously forgot. like had to go to my birth year and count forward. i feel like i'm stuck in my early stages of adolescence. when something happens that really pushes me i don't act my age, i act like a child. all fragile and angsty and self mutilating. i have savviness for someone my age, but my mind is stuck in my teens and my soul is stuck in my childhood. i'm wondering how to emotionally grow up. any advice???

veronicavix - i watched a movie called 'NUMB' yesterday about a guy with depersonalisation. he smoked pot and then for the rest of the movie kept asking people if they think it was the pot that caused it and kicked himself over taking it. someone said the likeliness was that depersonalisation would have come on anyway but the pot triggered it. i think it's the same for depression. i know while i was being treated for depression i was very closed off from the world and the loneliness just made me go in in into myself which of course opens up the window for staring at yourself as an outsider until eventually for me, i couldn't bring myself back to.. myself, i guess..even a little bit.
as far as drugs go i was taking my anti depressants as lines so that certainly didn't help! lol. i was just in that sort of crowd. i know for sure that made things a bit worse too coz i gave it to a friend to try and she described her expereince as 'feeling like everything's over there instead of here'. but i've had dp all my life. i think those experiences may have just made me more aware of it. i can't be sure. did you have it before the drugs and depression?

i don't think i had it before the drugs. i had other anxiety problems which have pretty much been replaced by the derealization. i had really bad separation anxiety for my mother which seemed somewhat normal to my family because it was right after my dad passed on. it stopped when i hit highschool but in retrospect i think it was only replaced by the anxities i deal with today, which i silenced with drugs and alcohol. on top of that i became a compulstive eater after he died aswell.. now it seems like derealization stepped in to replace the anxieties.. i've quit drugsand controlled my diet, lost weight and all.. i still have some anxiety obviously, butit feels like th dr happened after the drugs ONLY because i wasn't doing anything to direct my mind away from dealing with anything(drugs..).. so now my brain does it itself by puting itself in a dr state.
its like you say, lalaland. the drugs did not CAUSE the dr necessarily. it came on because my brain needed it to. it makes me feel so inferior because whenever i was offered the option of antidepressants i said that i would never take them because it felt it wasnt natural or healthy, mentally.. this just goes to show how ignorant i was, becuase i was just finding other ways to avoid feelingthe sadness. i was doing it without realizing what i was doing.. and even when i decided to stop doing that, my brain defended me against facing my own reality on its own.
its so hard because now i know that there is something deep inside of me that's so strong that even my brain felt the need to proect me from it. i know its there, i feel it rising in me sometimes i i look at my family or see a father-daughter moment in movies or tv shows, or even aroundmyfriends.. i feel the pain rising and i am conciously aware that i cannot deal with it. it's harder for me than dealing with dr, but i do have to live with both.
i know that when i cope with the inner pain the derealization will go away, its hard knowing that, and also knowing that i'm too weak to even try.
but i am more confident no that i realize what i have to do, i dont feel so lost anymore. please dont try to get rid of dr/dp with antidepressants or drugs or anything but personal reflection and meditation and understanding. i'm 100% sure that it's nothing physical.. (although i cant speak for everyone.)

Its been nearly 3 months now since my awful, life changing trip with marijuana ..

i believe that derealization is something you have to fight through yourself .. i got through it without any medication but the long term for me has just been the mood swings and constant depression .. i still get the days where i feel so detached from my friends and disorientated .. im getting through it and to evryone else out there.. just believe in yourself and you'll get through it .. its just a matter of motivation, honest X

Hi Lalaland, sorry I'm replying so late...

referring to your comment re 2008-04-05

--i forgot my age a few days ago. like really seriously forgot. like had to go to my birth year and count forward. i feel like i'm stuck in my early stages of adolescence. when something happens that really pushes me i don't act my age, i act like a child. all fragile and angsty and self mutilating. i have savviness for someone my age, but my mind is stuck in my teens and my soul is stuck in my childhood

Yes, I feel a lot like that. I often forget my age too, but only by a year or so. It used to be worse -- I'd forget it within 2 or 3 years.

And I also feel that 'stuck in my early stages of adolescence', and everything else you said. I also had a mutilation stage...and have ugly scars to remember it by.

Even now, I still feel stuck in my teens even though I'm in my 30's, especially when it comes to important things like work and relationships.

Do you think it might have to do with your self-esteem? I know that when people expect important things of me, ie making decisions at work or coming up with ideas, I feel I'm not smart enough or good enough to do it, and that no one will think my ideas or decisions are very good. I actually see myself as a child and think 'why are you asking me? Can't you see I'm not old enough to do all that?'

Have you ever spoken to a therapist about this? I did. And he said it has to do with self-esteem. I'm stuck in my childhood, and sometimes in my teens, because those are the times when I was hurt the most by my parents. Not necessarily physically hurt, but emotionally abandoned. This can arrest our development.

And when you add in how damaging emotional and/or physical trauma can be for one's self-esteem, you have the perfect recipe for an adult-child who doesn't think they're very valuable.

What has worked for me over the past 10 years is:

1) Cognitive behaviour therapy--
Most therapists don't really know about it yet because it's very new. It's been around for only about 10 years or so. I read 'Feeling Good' by David D Burns, MD. I used it in my therapy because my therapist was quite up on these ideas.

2)Some tapes I downloaded called 'Overcoming Social Anxiety
Step by Step'
The Social Anxiety Institute,
Thomas A. Richards, Ph.D., Director

I like Dr Richards very much because his therapy uses CBT (Cognitive Behaviour Therapy) a lot to change our automatic negative thoughts, which lead to depression and anxiety and all the other mood disorders we suffer from to a certain extent.

It really works!!! You have to really stick to it though. But I love the way you can hear his voice in the lessons. Just hearing his voice really calms me down. There are exercises to do to reduce your mental static, ie all those negative thoughts that make you feel bad about yourself and lead to anxiety.

3) I also have been listening for 4 years to CDs put out by Centerpointe Research Institute Technology: Holosynch
(you can google it.)

The founder, Bill Harris, patented a unique technology in which very low frequencies are inbedded in the CDs along with very nice rain and temple gong sounds, to make your brain start to function in a 'whole brain' manner. We usually just use either the right or the left sides of our brains in daily life. But when we unite both sides and use them at the same time, we gain even more self-awareness...This leads to deeper understanding of our self-image and our automatic negative thoughts.

Thus, by becoming aware of the ANTs, we can learn to observe them and in this way, they no longer control us and cause so many problems, like depression, anxiety, and feeling 'not good enough' etc.

4) I read Eckart Tolle's book A New Earth, and I'm currently watching him and Oprah do a 10-week course on the web that you can access for free at Oprah's homepage. (it won't let me put in the internet site...but just type in Oprah, and you'll see her homepage.)
It's really great and I have so many ah-ha moments about why I feel the way I do and ways to let go.

5) Homeopathy. It really worked for me! I am much more calm and at peace. I can go things, like go out, talk to people, without anxiety. Plus, I was able to come off my anti-depressant and Xanex.

I REALLY hope everyone who reads this post can find something that helps them. I feel for you. And I agree with StephyGurl5 that you can get through it. Nothing is instant. You have to work at things, whether it's therapy or homeopathy, the holosync tapes, reading some books, staying with your medication, doing some Cognitive Behaviour Therapy either with your therapist or using a program. The key, I think, is to change those nasty automatic negative thoughts about yourself. They feed on your depression and anxiety. It feeds them. But if we become the witness or observers of our thoughts, and thus, the ANTs, we can say STOP! I don't want to have you anymore. And they will shrink up and disappear over time. We have to retrain our minds to think in a different way. I think that's what's really helped me over the years.

I'm still working on things, like my self-esteem. But I have really come a long way, I think.

And thanks to all the kind and strong people who are struggling and who write posts here in the forum! You are all SO great for being so brave and facing this!

We can make it!!!

Hi all again,

Regarding Automatic Negative Thoughts or ANTs:

I didn't used to think I had ANTs that were sabatoging my sefl-esteem and causing despression, anxiety, and wanting to hurt myself. But the fact is, I had them. I just didn't know I had them because they were too deep in my subconscious. And for a good reason: they stay locked away in our subconscious because they are very painful to confront. Our minds put them there to protect us and to help us get on with out lives.

But there are ways to help yourself feel 'ready' to face them. That's the key. So, whatever way you find to get stronger, ie through some anti-depressants, or anti-anxiety medication, do it. But the thing to remember is that these medications aren't a long term solution.

For me, they helped me feel 'strong' enough to face my ANTs and thus, I was able to let them go through some Cognitive Behaviour Therapy exercises. (ie, the Feeling Good book, and Dr Richards course on overcoming social anxiety, there are some fun and very interesting exercises to help let go of your ANTs)

The idea behind CBT is that eventually, once you know how to deal with your ANTs, you can go off the medication. You effectively retrain your mind to not pay attention to the ANTs that try to bring you down.

Ok, that's it for now. Please, everybody, don't give up. I'm trying to figure out how to find a therapist who does CGT. I guess you could try the internet. But I'm not sure. Anyway, I think CBT is diffused enough these days that more therapists use it. Like I said, when I started CBT, it was more than 10 years ago. So, don't despair. Maybe you could ask your current therapist if they anyone in your area?

Hey sunnyisorange,
just curious... you say you've been seeing someone for 10 years (I assume for both the anxiety and depression), how is your depression/anxiety now compared to, say, ten years ago? I mean, it sounds like you are doing pretty good, you sound very positive--especially for someone who used to cut themselves; I mean, sunnyisorange is a pretty upbeat name for someone who used to do that. (I see you got rain cd's! You like to party too, huh?) Also, how long have you been with the dr/dp stuff? Has it been off and on, or steady?

This is for anyone...

ACCEPTANCE is so important here. If you haven't already, accept the dp/dr--which means: don't fight it, say you hate it, or wait until it goes away to start living again. Oddly enough, I've been feeling grateful for it. If you accept the dp/dr it will turn into a neutral thing, just something that is there, it can't affect how you feel unless you let it. I think that is the main reason--for me--that it's getting better. And if you embrace this thing you can become a larger person than you were before, without a doubt.
Later...

Hi Dikkid,
I just saw your reply... :-)

I haven't been seeing a therapist for 10 years. I only saw a therapist for about 2 years around 10 or 12 years ago.

And that therapy, which was CBT, really helped me. He also had me on anti-depressants to get through some hard times.

But I kept doing my own work, ie with the meditation CDs (holosync), reading some books and I also stayed on anti-depressants for about 15 years :-)

I went through tough times, ie hurting myself, and heavy depression. But I kept doing the meditation because it was working really well for my Mom. She also was able to go off her anti-depressants too. (I had to get to the fourth level of the CD's before I could go off the anti-depressants, about a year ago.)

And all this time, I had anxiety...ie, couldn't breath and tightness in chest, dizziness, feeling disassociated from myself and things like that.

Then, a few months ago I took some homeopathy that really helped my anxiety.

Regarding d/p and d/r, I remember my first encounter with these feelings when I was about 15. (I hadn't taken any drugs.) And they continued off and on over the years depending on the severity of my depression. If I took my anti-depressants faithfully, the feelings of d/p and d/r were kept in check. However, I wasn't very good at staying on them because there's always that troublesome voice that says 'you don't need them anymore.' Sound familiar to anyone? :-)

I really agree with you about acceptance. Yes, I think if we just let whatever happens in our minds be ok, we get some relief.

As for partying, well, I've never really liked to party. :-) There was a time when I experminented with certain drugs...but...they only emphasised my feelings of not belonging, paranoia,panic, depression, d/p and d/r quite badly, to the point where I gave it all up. It was at time that I adopted 2 stray dogs and 4 cats! (I didn't plan it)

And my life really changed for the better. I started focussing on the animals' well-being, I started thinking about 'gosh, if something happens to me, who'll take care of them?'. My animals companions, essentially, saved my life :-)

And now, like you said, I'm not so afraid of when those feelings of d/p and d/r come. But, they have really lessened in their intensity over time. What is 'real' anyway? If I ask myself this question, I don't feel so afraid.

I'm so glad you're feeling better dikkid. Yes, I'm feeling much better these days. Thank you for commenting on that. I'm glad to hear I sound positive to you! I think when I give suggestions in this forum, it helps me to have faith. Having a place where we can exchange ideas and help each other is really great! The worst thing is to feel isolated and that you don't have anyone to talk to. But if you can share your feelings with others who have had similar experiences, it really seems to help.

ps. I think exercise can really help too. But since I didn't used to feel comfortable going outside. So I got an at-home exercise video. It's really helped. (I still prefer to exercise in the house :-) )

Do you like to party? How does it make you feel?

Hi again,
sorry, dikkid, I should've said 'do you like to party, and if so, how does it make you feel?' I didn't mean to assume that you like to party. :-)

Hey sunnyisorange,
the party thing was just a joke refering to another joke I made on an earlier post about the sounds of recorded rain making great party music. (dry-humour is tricky online) No, I've never been a 'partier.' A beer here and there maybe; only used weed because I thought it might help me get in touch with something deeper. To be honest I've never liked being drunk or high because I don't like that foggy and disoriented feeling. Now I feel that way when sober. How ironic.

Hi dikkid,

Now I get it! :-)
sorry about that :-)

Hi all,
No one's written for a while. Is everyone ok?